The Hookup Ranks Budget Cameras under $50

[wittaj]

I love how Rob knows what is coming from many of us that he simply says it LOL "So big surprise everybody Rob's going to say that the Reolink 510a is the best budget camera under $50" However, he does caveat it with the nighttime video is not as good.





He ranks the Reolink 510a as the best budget camera followed by the Amcrest Amcrest 5MP-T1179EW for cameras under $50.



We know the Reolink has trouble with motion as the firmware simply favors a bright static image over motion quality, but I can't help to think the Amcrest is still suffering from running on default settings as I pointed out in another thread commenting on his video





Many here will agree that Reolink does a great job with enough light, but they suffer tremendously at night. However, in most instances, you want to get a camera that will perform at your location for the worse situation - which for most of us is at night when it is dark and there is little to no light. If a camera performs at night, it is easier to tweak settings to make it work during the day than it is the other way around.

While the Reolink provides great daytime images and the app is probably the most user friendly, the night performance and difficulty to use it with other systems if one decides to move away from one brand, make it a hard one for me to recommend. I would opt for the Amcrest for more flexibility and then optimize it the best you can.

 

[mat200]

I love how Rob knows what is coming from many of us that he simply says it LOL "So big surprise everybody Rob's going to say that the Reolink 510a is the best budget camera under $50" However, he does caveat it with the nighttime video is not as good.

View attachment 140061

View attachment 140062

He ranks the Reolink 510a as the best budget camera followed by the Amcrest Amcrest 5MP-T1179EW for cameras under $50.



We know the Reolink has trouble with motion as the firmware simply favors a bright static image over motion quality, but I can't help to think the Amcrest is still suffering from running on default settings as I pointed out in another thread commenting on his video


View attachment 140064


Many here will agree that Reolink does a great job with enough light, but they suffer tremendously at night. However, in most instances, you want to get a camera that will perform at your location for the worse situation - which for most of us is at night when it is dark and there is little to no light. If a camera performs at night, it is easier to tweak settings to make it work during the day than it is the other way around.

While the Reolink provides great daytime images and the app is probably the most user friendly, the night performance and difficulty to use it with other systems if one decides to move away from one brand, make it a hard one for me to recommend. I would opt for the Amcrest for more flexibility and then optimize it the best you can.

Humorous .. as on that screen shot clearly looks like Amcrest 5MP beats the snot out of the Reolink 5MP ..

and yet, he wonders why some think he's a Reolink Shill ..

 

[Holbs]

waiting for Wittaj YouTube video of best camera for under $200
It... "bothers" me that people make the same mistake about chasing after 8MP/4K cameras, which is chasing after lower and lower $$$. Being lead away from what a person who is looking into security cameras for a purpose (which could be stalker, abusive ex-partner, high vehicle crimes in the area, etc). Sure, we all could get $50 cheap cameras. But promoting and rehashing something like a popular YouTube'r (I like his vids btw and am a subscriber there)... I wish they would stipulate in the end something like "oh...if you want a security camera because your ex-boyfriend who beat the crap out of you and you have a protection order in place, does it's job 24 hours a day, day or night, then get this XXXX manufacturer. I could not jeopardize your safety with this crappy night camera"
It sure seems 90% of criminal activity happens in the dark for the small petty stuff. Statistics say 50% day/50% night but that includes breaking and entering (usually done when folks are at work). Influencers should make it a strong point in regards to such things instead of saying 'oh well, night images are a little blurry as a white guy in a white t-shirt walking briskly past your camera...but it is a fantastic day camera!"

Example: could you imagine my tire slasher event using $50 cameras? I would be out 6-7 sets of tires by now because I would of had no 9pm or 2am night time image/video clarity enough for a facial ID. And she still would be running free.

 

[jumpinghippo1]

Humorous .. as on that screen shot clearly looks like Amcrest 5MP beats the snot out of the Reolink 5MP ..

and yet, he wonders why some think he's a Reolink Shill ..

Can you use a reolink nvr with any of Andy's cameras?

 

[wittaj]

Can you use a reolink nvr with any of Andy's cameras?

NOPE - as much as they say they are ONVIF, they are not.

Plus it is simply good practice to match camera brand with NVR brand.

 

[jumpinghippo1]

NOPE - as much as they say they are ONVIF, they are not.

Plus it is simply good practice to match camera brand with NVR brand.

How is reolink's color night vision with cameras that have lights on the camera?
RLC-811A

 

[wittaj]

They suffer from the same problems. You just cannot get enough light to them.

Reolink: Low Light Review from "Reolink 4K POE Bullet IP Camera Comparison - RLC 810A vs RLC 811A" securitybros

Review from youtube 1080p .. do go to youtube for the original content and a higher resolution .. Reolink 4K POE Bullet IP Camera Comparison - RLC 810A vs RLC 811A Apr 21, 2022 securitybros In this video we test and compare two of Reolink's 4K POE Bullet IP Cameras, the RLC-810A and the...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[jumpinghippo1]

They suffer from the same problems. You just cannot get enough light to them.

Reolink: Low Light Review from "Reolink 4K POE Bullet IP Camera Comparison - RLC 810A vs RLC 811A" securitybros

Review from youtube 1080p .. do go to youtube for the original content and a higher resolution .. Reolink 4K POE Bullet IP Camera Comparison - RLC 810A vs RLC 811A Apr 21, 2022 securitybros In this video we test and compare two of Reolink's 4K POE Bullet IP Cameras, the RLC-810A and the...

ipcamtalk.com

Yea I guess it seems like the only advantage is the reolink app not the cameras lol

 

[wittaj]

Pretty much LOL. Or if you have a need only for daytime or inside cameras in a building that has great lighting on 24/7.

 

[sebastiantombs]

It all comes down to you get what you pay for. If you by inexpensive cameras expect inexpensive (crap) results. If you buy more expensive, semi-pro models, expect good results. If you buy top-of-the-line cameras expect top-of-the-line results. As @looney2ns says "buy once, cry once".

 

[mat200]

Can you use a reolink nvr with any of Andy's cameras?

Hi @jumpinghippo1

Reolink cheats on various fronts from what we have seen, they have to do firmware cheats due to the very affordable hardware components they use .. one of those that suffers due to this is meeting specs .. that and low light performance really suffers and it is easy to see that in video captures.

This is why most here really dislike Reolink .. can not get them to interoperate with products that meet specs better.

It is too bad, as many start in the IP PoE world with cheap Reolink cameras / sets.

This is why we encourage people to learn more, and watch out for the Reolink shills .. you'll see lots of "Reolink is the greatest" in other forums as well as in youtube .. despite the clear evidence that Reolink has significant issues which customers should pay attention to when deciding on a purchase. ( hint - Reolink, do not get if you want or need low light performance or compatibility / meeting specs )

Q: "How is reolink's color night vision with cameras that have lights on the camera?" -
A: Crap ( hint search Reolink in the titles in this forum .. see search icon in the upper right on a desktop ... )

Q: "Yea I guess it seems like the only advantage is the reolink app not the cameras lol "
A: Too bad I can't show how great the app is in court ( or to the police / leo ) to convince the Jury that the image capture was worth it ...

update: Reolink search on title here in this forum

Search results for query: Reolink

ipcamtalk.com

 

[mat200]

It's very clear that Reolink purposefully maximizes low light still image capture quality at the expense of low light moving image capture.
( Reolink reportedly cheats the settings to maximize still image capture .. )

Ask, do you need image capture of subject staying still or moving?

( also, remember many Reolink cameras have a tighter FOV giving you a longer DORI range .. thus the text may appear sharper compared to other cameras which have wider FOVs .. )


update:

He lists:
Top Picks:
Reolink RLC-510A: https://amzn.to/3qdBy0s
Amcrest 5MP-T1179EW: https://amzn.to/3KGRfHc

Amcrest
Amcrest 5MP Turret POE Camera, UltraHD Outdoor IP Camera POE with Mic/Audio, 5-Megapixel Security Surveillance Cameras, 98ft NightVision, 2.8mm Lens (103° FOV), IP67, MicroSD (256GB), (IP5M-T1179EW)
Field of View: H 103° V 71° D 132°

Reolink
REOLINK Security IP Camera Outdoor, 5MP Home Surveillance Outdoor Indoor PoE Camera, Human/Vehicle Detection, 100Ft IR Night Vision, Work with Smart Home, Up to 256GB Micro SD Card, RLC-510A
Field of View Horizontal: 80° Vertical: 42°


Just the FOV difference will result in the Reolink having more pixels on target at the distance Rob is holding the text .. thus creating the false impression that the Reolink does a better job without covering the issues of FOV differences.

 

[jrbeddow]

Bizarrely, even though his videos have improved significantly, at one or two points in this budget camera review, he does comparisons to the Dahua (EmpireTech) 5442, yet unfortunately he seems to have adjusted that camera to use way, WAY too much WDR, or some other brightness/contrast settings that blow out too much detail (overly bright). Some people can't seem to resist that temptation to assume that the brightest picture is the "best"one.

 

[jumpinghippo1]

Where can I find the chart again with MP and sensor size optimal ratios?

 

[wittaj]

Here you go:

Night time camera selection w/motion involved

Everyone shops for a camera with a different approach to what might be the best camera for their install. I always check MP against sensor size as a way to remove undesirable cameras from my search. Once I found a camera with a desirable MP and sensor combo, I would then dig deeper on FOV...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[d5775927]

There is no way the 5442 lost in any of the tests.
Guessing he a used default config.
Also, the comparison is bad he needs to compare IPC up to 50$ with the same field of view (and adjust 5442ZE to match that field of view).

TL;DR: total waste of time

 

[Mike A.]

That Amcrest 5 MP cam probably is the best cheap < $50 cam that I've found. I know I can get it better than he shows. If I could still get the 3.6mm version I might buy another one. Better than it should be for the sensor ratio and price. But no way it competes with the 5442 or other better cams.

 

[KenAllen15]

It's very clear that Reolink purposefully maximizes low light still image capture quality at the expense of low light moving image capture.
( Reolink reportedly cheats the settings to maximize still image capture .. )

Ask, do you need image capture of subject staying still or moving?

( also, remember many Reolink cameras have a tighter FOV giving you a longer DORI range .. thus the text may appear sharper compared to other cameras which have wider FOVs .. )


update:

He lists:
Top Picks:
Reolink RLC-510A: https://amzn.to/3qdBy0s
Amcrest 5MP-T1179EW: https://amzn.to/3KGRfHc

Amcrest
Amcrest 5MP Turret POE Camera, UltraHD Outdoor IP Camera POE with Mic/Audio, 5-Megapixel Security Surveillance Cameras, 98ft NightVision, 2.8mm Lens (103° FOV), IP67, MicroSD (256GB), (IP5M-T1179EW)
Field of View: H 103° V 71° D 132°

Reolink
REOLINK Security IP Camera Outdoor, 5MP Home Surveillance Outdoor Indoor PoE Camera, Human/Vehicle Detection, 100Ft IR Night Vision, Work with Smart Home, Up to 256GB Micro SD Card, RLC-510A
Field of View Horizontal: 80° Vertical: 42°


Just the FOV difference will result in the Reolink having more pixels on target at the distance Rob is holding the text .. thus creating the false impression that the Reolink does a better job without covering the issues of FOV differences.

At 6:24 in the video he appears to say exactly that

 

[mat200]

At 6:24 in the video he appears to say exactly that

That's good that he is covering this better.. still

The issue is that many people have short attention spans and are very visual .. so that will be missed unless you put the visuals into the proper perspective.

( we live now in a TikTok world with emojis instead of reading .. )

 

[mat200]

" .. the Amcrest 5MP that had consistently decent performance in all conditions, between the two the Amcrest also has a significantly greater field of view at 105 degrees vs the Reolink's 80 degrees which could definitely account for some of the differences in the image clarity at 25 feet but it shouldn't completely discount the Reolink's excellent daytime performance .. " - TheHookUp *

Let's do the math .. as Math Matters .. ( Physics .. )


From the cliff notes, DORI section:
The equation to calculate the Radius (the distance in feet) for identification for 100 ppf as discussed above: Radius = (( Horizontal Res / 100 ppf ) * ( 360 / Angle ))/2*Pi

Amcrest ProHD Outdoor Security IP Turret PoE Camera, 5-Megapixel, 98ft NightVision, 2.8mm Lens, IP67 Weatherproof, MicroSD Recording (256GB), White (IP5M-T1179EW-28MM)
2.8mm Lens with a 103° viewing angle

Image Sensor 1/2.7” 5Megapixel progressive CMOS
Effective Pixels 2592 (H) × 1944 (V)
Angle of View H: 103° / V: 71°/ D: 132°

Thus

Radius = (( 2592 / 100 )* ( 360 / 103 )) / 2*Pi = 14.4 feet for the "100 ppf ID distance"

IP5M-T1179EW-36MM ( which currently is not available in the Amcrest store ) specs report:
H: 84° / V: 58°/ D: 110

Radius = (( 2592 / 100 )* ( 360 / 84 )) / 2*Pi = 17.688 feet for the "100 ppf ID distance"

Reolink RLC-510A specs listed as ( from Reolink website )

2560x1920 (5.0 Megapixels)
Field of View
• Horizontal: 80°
• Vertical: 42°

pixels listed a bit less ...

Radius =((2560 / 100 )*(360 / 80 )) / 2*Pi = 18.34 feet for the "100 ppf ID distance" ... ( if the same resolution as Amcrest .. then 18.57 feet )


So, to really compare the quality of the image capture between the Reolink 5MP RLC-510 and Amcrest 5MP 2.8mm cameras and reduce the FOV / lens differences as much as possible you should compare the image captures from the following distances:
Amcrest 5MP 2.8mm - 14.4 feet
Reolink 5MP RLC-510A - 18.3 feet

Since most of the video comparisons compare a Wider FOV Amcrest 5MP cameras vs the Reolink 5MP .. the quick view seems to show the Reolink is better quality in image capture ( example of the TEST text ).

Ideally you want the same lens strength in the cameras you are comparing .. in this case Amcrest did have a 3.6mm version, and that would be better to compare to this Reolink model.

Such it is, I believe most just looking at the image capture will over look the math and physics .. and think the Reolink is somehow superior even tho Rob only has one leg in the low light image capture with the Reolink and has 2 legs with the low light image capture with the Amcrest 5mp


Also remember, best to tune the parameters for your setup to get better results, as each location has different lighting ..



Ok .. so at 25 feet ... find X .. ( ppf )

Radius = 25 feet = (( Horizontal Res / X ppf ) * ( 360 / Angle ))/2*Pi
X ppf = ( Horizontal Res * ( 360 / Angle ) ) / ( 25 * 2*pi )

So at 25 feet .. ( i'll use the same H Res for both cameras )
Amcrest 5MP 2.8mm 103° :
57 ppf = ( 2560 * 360 / 103 ) / 50*Pi

Reolink 5MP 80°:
73.4 ppf = ( 2560*360 / 80 ) / 50*Pi

Comparing the 2 .. Reolink / Amcrest ppf at 25 feet = 73.4 / 57 = 1.28

SO the Reolink has 28% more pixels per foot at 25 feet ..

Do you think 73.4 ppf vs 57 ppf makes a difference?
Do you think this makes a significant difference?

imho YES .. absolutely. ( remember TheHookUp does note this, but I do not think he's done to math to really see how significant this difference is .. )

Now, had we had a Amcrest 3.6mm which has a 84° H FOV the ppf calculation ( again, I'll use the same H Res )
69.9 ppf = ( 2560 * 360 / 84 ) / 50*Pi

The Amcrest 5MP 3.6mm is the model you really want to test vs the Reolink 5MP ..


It really is important to understand the DORI principles and FOV when planning your setup.