Camera Faceoff: Dahua Starlight IPC-T5442TM-AS vs Hikvision ColorVu DS-2CD2347G1-LU
- Thread starter pbc
- Start date
Thought I posted it earlier. But I would say if I was to do it again, I'd likely have purchased all IR based cameras, so either the Dahua 5442's or whatever is the equivalent Hikvision camera. The only reason to get a ColorVu type camera is where you're going to keep the LED light on at all times, want a camera that shines a spot light when a motion is triggered, or have ample ambient light.
With exposure set to 1/250, you can get "decent enough" video with minimal ghosting (thanks Alistair ...switched back to Normal noise reduction and 30 which helped). If you go higher than that to get more light, the picture certainly looks stunning, but motion suffers incredibly as people walk by (they look like ghosts).
Below is this morning, I have a street light across the street on the right side, and a street light on my right neighbours lawn, and the moon is out as well, albeit low since it is 6am. 1/250 exposure, 70 gain.
For situations like the below it's pretty good.
The second pic is from my Hik front door camera, which I have at 1/200 exp, 70 gain. You can see the street light post on the lawn. But I need to go to about 1/120 for decent exposure/light in the pic, but at that point motion is useless. But I have it set so that the LED comes on when an event is triggered, though I find it's hit and miss for whatever reason with the LED coming on, maybe because it is so dark the motion doesn't trigger.
A camera with IR on the other hand (backyard pic), provides a nice image. Is it color? No. Would the bad actor/person you capture in the video have somewhat IR Washed out details in the face? Yes. But the reality is it beats a ghosted image or a super dark image in that location where to use the Colorvu I had to keep the exposure at 1/120 or even 1/60 to get enough light in, at which point and in darkness I basically looked like the invisible man when I walked by at anything other than an absolute snails pace.
So the shortened answer is, if you have light as good or better than I do in my driveway area, or are okay using the LED spot light function, the colorvu camera is great. But for the vast majority of situations and good video with motion, I'm betting the IR would be a better choice. Plus the 5442's color capabilities are pretty darn close to the ColorVu to boot.
Outside of just IR, I also find the Dahua's have a much more tweakable firmware interface, and seem to be offering more "cutting edge" tech, such as people detection algorithms which the Hik at this level does not (albeit if you use BlueIris, it doesn't really matter). Having said that, the Hik might be considered more "user friendly". since it doesn't have as many options.
With exposure set to 1/250, you can get "decent enough" video with minimal ghosting (thanks Alistair ...switched back to Normal noise reduction and 30 which helped). If you go higher than that to get more light, the picture certainly looks stunning, but motion suffers incredibly as people walk by (they look like ghosts).
Below is this morning, I have a street light across the street on the right side, and a street light on my right neighbours lawn, and the moon is out as well, albeit low since it is 6am. 1/250 exposure, 70 gain.
For situations like the below it's pretty good.
The second pic is from my Hik front door camera, which I have at 1/200 exp, 70 gain. You can see the street light post on the lawn. But I need to go to about 1/120 for decent exposure/light in the pic, but at that point motion is useless. But I have it set so that the LED comes on when an event is triggered, though I find it's hit and miss for whatever reason with the LED coming on, maybe because it is so dark the motion doesn't trigger.
A camera with IR on the other hand (backyard pic), provides a nice image. Is it color? No. Would the bad actor/person you capture in the video have somewhat IR Washed out details in the face? Yes. But the reality is it beats a ghosted image or a super dark image in that location where to use the Colorvu I had to keep the exposure at 1/120 or even 1/60 to get enough light in, at which point and in darkness I basically looked like the invisible man when I walked by at anything other than an absolute snails pace.
So the shortened answer is, if you have light as good or better than I do in my driveway area, or are okay using the LED spot light function, the colorvu camera is great. But for the vast majority of situations and good video with motion, I'm betting the IR would be a better choice. Plus the 5442's color capabilities are pretty darn close to the ColorVu to boot.
Outside of just IR, I also find the Dahua's have a much more tweakable firmware interface, and seem to be offering more "cutting edge" tech, such as people detection algorithms which the Hik at this level does not (albeit if you use BlueIris, it doesn't really matter). Having said that, the Hik might be considered more "user friendly". since it doesn't have as many options.
bigredfish
Known around here
The problem with both of your color images is that your subject (close in area) is backlit. Poor lighting, not indicative of the camera's capabilities. No camera can "make" light where there isnt any, like in front of your vehicles
Dahua 5442-NI "Full Color" bullet- 1/120, Gain 45 is fine if you have the light shining from the right direction (normal driveway coach lights)
Dahua 5442-NI "Full Color" bullet- 1/120, Gain 45 is fine if you have the light shining from the right direction (normal driveway coach lights)
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I don't disagree, I keep my driveway lights on until ~4am or so, and they help quite a bit even though they are not powerful lights whatsoever (small LEDs, but see below).
I think the problem is where folks expect the ColorVu cams to take very little light and perform much better. I thought they would perform better in the lighting conditions I had, incorrectly believing that because I had a light across the way somehow the camera would "magically" see my front porch better and create light where there wasn't. I probably should have only purchased one and tested it in various locations, but got "Excited" when I saw how great the picture looked with exposure set to 1/30 or 1/60, it was literally as if day light was outside. But then testing it with motion/video showed how badly it performed when it counted.
So I'm simply saying that I'm betting the vast majority of the time where they don't have ample light sources, like in your situation, an IR based camera is going to be preferable. Plus, in a situation like yours, you can use the 5442TM-AS and I'm betting get very similar results in color mode. But have the option to switch to IR if there ends up not being enough light.
With this particular Hik model, if you end up not having enough light...you'd have to add a light source.
I think the problem is where folks expect the ColorVu cams to take very little light and perform much better. I thought they would perform better in the lighting conditions I had, incorrectly believing that because I had a light across the way somehow the camera would "magically" see my front porch better and create light where there wasn't. I probably should have only purchased one and tested it in various locations, but got "Excited" when I saw how great the picture looked with exposure set to 1/30 or 1/60, it was literally as if day light was outside. But then testing it with motion/video showed how badly it performed when it counted.
So I'm simply saying that I'm betting the vast majority of the time where they don't have ample light sources, like in your situation, an IR based camera is going to be preferable. Plus, in a situation like yours, you can use the 5442TM-AS and I'm betting get very similar results in color mode. But have the option to switch to IR if there ends up not being enough light.
With this particular Hik model, if you end up not having enough light...you'd have to add a light source.
bigredfish
Known around here
Yep Agree, if you cant insure consistent good white light you're better off with a camera that can do IR. A good clean crsip IR image is better than a poor noisy, blurry color image.
The 5442-NI doesnt have and cant see IR. But it's so sensitive that it does quite well in B&W with some light.
Auto everything/Default
View attachment 4116P_ch2_20200726215959_B&W-EXP-Auto-ExComp50-DNR50.mp4
The 5442-NI doesnt have and cant see IR. But it's so sensitive that it does quite well in B&W with some light.
Auto everything/Default
View attachment 4116P_ch2_20200726215959_B&W-EXP-Auto-ExComp50-DNR50.mp4
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bigredfish
Known around here
Here's comparisons of the plain 5442 and the NI
Auto, 1/30, 1/60, 1/120, 1/250 (Std 5442 on Left ---- 5442 NI Full Color on Right
In the 1/120 - 1/250 range which is the sweet spot in my testing for color night video without blur, the Full Color model really shines.
Auto, 1/30, 1/60, 1/120, 1/250 (Std 5442 on Left ---- 5442 NI Full Color on Right
In the 1/120 - 1/250 range which is the sweet spot in my testing for color night video without blur, the Full Color model really shines.
bigredfish
Known around here
I should mention that while I dont use HiK equipment, I suspect their Full Color ColorVu would perform very similarly
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The exposure in that video is 1/125? That's great motion if so. Curious, why would one choose black and white over color without IR?
bigredfish
Known around here
The video is Auto - all settings default as noted.
Dunno, I suppose if you cant be assured of consistent white light for color, B&W is an option as it wont blur as bad or create near the noise that color mode wil below a certain light threshold. Of course with no light they both suck. Thus back to your original comment that B&W/IR is preferable where you can't assure consistent white light.
Dunno, I suppose if you cant be assured of consistent white light for color, B&W is an option as it wont blur as bad or create near the noise that color mode wil below a certain light threshold. Of course with no light they both suck. Thus back to your original comment that B&W/IR is preferable where you can't assure consistent white light.
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timblaktu
n3wb
Very interesting and useful conversation. Has anyone here made light measurements at the various locations in these cameras field of view, to see how your situation measures up to the cameras' spec?
I'm trying to pick some good low light performers for my house, which also has street lights on 2 sides and neighbors lights on the other. Was leaning towards the ColorVu but was planning to disable it's leds bc I think they will annoy neighbors. Perhaps I will install a light meter app on my phone and do some measurements. The ColorVu go down to a tiny fraction of a Lux (or is it Lumen?) In the spec sheet but I wonder what that means - are they capturing long shutter stills at those light levels when they calculate spec sheets?
So, like @pbc I'm wondering whether I'll be better off with an IR based camera..
I'm trying to pick some good low light performers for my house, which also has street lights on 2 sides and neighbors lights on the other. Was leaning towards the ColorVu but was planning to disable it's leds bc I think they will annoy neighbors. Perhaps I will install a light meter app on my phone and do some measurements. The ColorVu go down to a tiny fraction of a Lux (or is it Lumen?) In the spec sheet but I wonder what that means - are they capturing long shutter stills at those light levels when they calculate spec sheets?
So, like @pbc I'm wondering whether I'll be better off with an IR based camera..
I have found with the colorvu cameras that turning on WDR to auto under the backlight setting in the image tab really helps even out an image with uneven lighting. Instead of a bright area and really dark area you get a nice even image.
bigredfish
Known around here
This is true of WDR with most any camera, however you should test it at night with motion as it tends to add motion blur.
With most cameras WDR does not activate in B&W, only in color, so you'll need plenty of light.
With most cameras WDR does not activate in B&W, only in color, so you'll need plenty of light.
OtilioGuerra
n3wb
From my understanding is that the Dahua Starlight camera and Hikvision DarkFighter are within the same category as these two have built in IR lamp. And then the HikVision ColorVu and the Dahua Full Color are in the same category as they both have a built in LED light nor IR.
I originally was looking at the Lorex Color Night Vision but which has a self-regulating shutter speed so the user doesn't have to worry about changing the shutter speed but I may consider buying one of their cameras.
I originally was looking at the Lorex Color Night Vision but which has a self-regulating shutter speed so the user doesn't have to worry about changing the shutter speed but I may consider buying one of their cameras.
Lorex is rebranded Dahua cams and um these other cameras referenced on this thread have auto shutters as well, but only someone not worried about getting good images at night would run them on auto shutter....in most instances auto shutter will result in blur motion as the shutter slows down a lot based on available light and all cameras need light regardless of what marketing term is used like Starlight or Full Color or DarkFighter...
Here is my Full Color Dahua at night in a pitch black location. So with this 1/120 shutter speed, I wanted to see if the camera could perform with only the LED white light from the camera. As you can see from this video, it barely recognized me at these settings. You would need to run 1/30 shutter with just the LED light light of the camera to be able to start to make a person out, but the image is way too dark and is a motion blur.
The average Joe will not spend the time to calibrate and will just leave the settings on auto and love the great still image they get and then just accept a blur/ghost motion at night. When do we need these to perform - at night!
Keep in mind that with the shutter at auto, it is a nice bright image, but motion was a blur...once you dial the camera in to actually be usable and get an image that the police can actually do something with, you see the limitations...
Check out this video at midnight. You see this and it looks like daytime and be like WOW I want that camera. But any motion in the frame and it is crap and will be a ghost blur. You notice they do not show anything with motion. I can make all my cameras look like this at midnight with no other light, but we want good motion video, not still images video. Don't get me wrong, this is a very nice camera and with enough light at night absolutely rocks - so do you have enough light at night? All cameras, regardless of what they are called, need light - either white light or infrared. Simple physics.
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