Suggestions for Weather observation IP camera, PTZ, 10-20X, 1080p+, Sub-$300

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troublebot

n3wb
Apr 14, 2016
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Hello all,

I live in Fort Worth, TX and do SKYWARN weather spotting for fun. I recently moved into a new apartment on the top floor of a building and have a great view facing north, and because it's so flat and we don't have a ton of tall buildings in my view, I can see for a nice long distance. A few weeks ago I was out on the balcony observing a severe thunderstorm that was moving through the area and spotted the initial formation of a funnel in an area where radar was showing rotation (the funnel collapsed shortly after, thankfully). It was dark but it was back-lit by lightning. Unfortunately, I didn't have a camera available except for my cell phone, so couldn't really get any images.


I did start looking at camcorders and DSLRs, I used to own a ton of cameras but over the years sold them and never replaced them. I have some cameras I manage at work that I'm free to use, but I'm not really looking to get pretty storm pictures, so much as I want to be able to get good, reviewable images of storms.


The new apartment has a ton of high windows and high cielings throughout, and the awning does a good job keeping rain off the windows without blocking too much of the sky. I'm not allowed to hang anything on the outside of the building (except some planters on the balcony railing), but I got to thinking that mounting a camera behind the window would give me the view I need. I can enclose it in a black box to keep reflections down on the glass, and/or use a polarizer to kill reflections. It's also north-facing so direct sunlight shouldn't be an issue.


So this is what I'm looking for (I think, feel free to suggest alternatives).


Needs:
IP camera, Ethernet (PoE if possible but not required)
1080p+, 30fps
PTZ (at least +80/-80 deg side-to-side, 30+/30- up/down)
10-20X Optical zoom (the more the merrier)
Manual controls for exposure etc.,
No IR LEDs or ability to disable IR LEDs
Under $300


Nice-to-haves:
Awesome low-light performance w/o LEDs
Under $150-200
Wide-angle when zoomed out
On-board recording
Compact, non-dome
Ability to customize or remove date/time/text overlay on video feed


It will have a computer dedicated to it and whatever software I end up running, and the computer, router and camera will be on a UPS. IP is preferred because it's just easier and I've got CAT5E in the walls already, but if something like HDMI out or analog HD to a capture card makes sense, I'll consider that.


As an alternative to having lots of zoom and good low light performance, I was thinking I could add a second bullet camera mounted/slaved to the PTZ camera that has a high fixed focal length and solid low-light performance and just run them together. I can make an adjustable mount which will let me boresight the cameras together, assuming the PTZ camera is sturdy enough and/or the slave camera is light enough. The more I think of it, the more I like this approach. But if a camera that "does it all" is available, then that'd be great.

I've purchased from Alibaba and Aliexpress before so that isn't an obstacle. Buying domestically is preferred, especially since storm season is already upon us so the sooner I can get it, the happier a camper I'll be.

Thanks for reading and any ideas or suggestions you have!
 
if you can do with 2MP (1080x1920) this one is closer to your price range and has the same sensor as the popular Huisun/Imporx mini PTZ (which does allow disabling the IR):
http://www.aliexpress.com/item/Blue...Speed-Dome-Full-HD1080P-Auto/32323387569.html

as for 'nothing allowed attached to the building', that's bullshit. They cannot disallow you from putting up a satellite dish for tv service, if you want to.
May not be worth fighting legally, but they might not even notice a little cam on the wall on the top floor balcony, depending on where you put it.

You could also just mount it to a pole on a piece of plywood held down with bricks on your patio/deck. not attached to the building... :-)

I mention that as I think trying to do it form behind a pane of glass will be problematic...
 
For Huisun/Imporx PTZs are not great without IR and you can't do low shutter (1/25 is minimum)
 
pozzello said:
as for 'nothing allowed attached to the building', that's bullshit. They cannot disallow you from putting up a satellite dish for tv service, if you want to.
May not be worth fighting legally, but they might not even notice a little cam on the wall on the top floor balcony, depending on where you put it.
Click to expand...

thats allowed due to FCC Regulation, you cannot prevent someone from picking up video transmissions via broadcast transmission, ie antennas.. its more for emergency broadcasts and CCTV cameras are definitely not in scope.. the law specifically says antennas and dishes and lists sizes.

For Weather Observation, the low light is going to be where you want to spend your money.. not so much on the PTZ part.. might try the Longse first and see if thats enough.. unless you have a 360 degree view why bother with PTZ, the more exposed to bad weather the more rugged or affordable to replace you want.. you can buy a couple longse's for your budget and cover more sky at the same time than a single PTZ could ever accomplish.

id want local sd card storage for such a camera recording backup video locally, if weather/lightning damages building you dont want to loose the money shot.. heck the camera could be found a mile away in a field and the sd card contain the final moments.. I'd also want a good battery backup and PTZ's take more power and would not last as long on the same size battery.. my big PTZ can pull 22W and most of my fixed cameras pull like 4W
 
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im going to also toss this out there, because ive been wanting to do this..

For Cannon Digital Cameras, the point and shoot kind.. there is an open source firmware hack avilable for most all models: http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/CHDK

With the hacked firmware you can run custom scripts to do all sorts of cool things, like automatically take photographs of lightning: http://chdk.wikia.com/wiki/Samples:_Lightning_photography

If your into Weather and Photography and Technology, this is a sweet little project.. and you can do it pretty damn cheap.. dedicate a camera to doing time lapse photos with long exposures on an external trigger, then lighting motion detection, in a water tight enclosure with a hardwired power source and see what nature brings you.. cant view it live but you can get like a 20MP timelapse out of it tha'd kick any security cam's ass.
 
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I lived in apartment once that did not allow attaching things to the deck/building. They told us if we wanted Satellite TV we had to cement a pole in a bucket and attach the dish to that.

Could be done for a cam.

Also check this for the huisun pic quality. What others have said is true, it's not the best without IR.
https://www.ipcamtalk.com/showthread.php/7109-First-Vid-HuisunPTZ-Night-(no-IR)

I'm getting ready to search for a speed dome for the same purpose as you.

But everyone else are correct, low light, shutter speed, are most important. Maybe just get a cam with zoom. If you do the bucket/pole mount you could manually move it.
@nayr didn't you just install a box cam with zoom?
 
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yeah my birdhouse ALPR, I drilled holes into concrete but I suppose you could mount it to a sheet of plywood or something.. would probably be better to get some clamps and bolt it to the balcony without any permanent modifications..

if you got a flat ethernet cable you could likely shut it in a window and it'd be fine.

the low light on this cam would be pretty suck for storms I think.. its nothing special on that front, but you can put any size lens you want on these box cams and I have seen them on aliexpress with the IMX178 sensor
 

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Just a point but look closely at camera specs if you're serious about the 30 degrees up angle on a PTZ. Down 30 or more is easy but many are 0 or +10 or so up.
 
Only one I have ever seen or used with any up tilt was the black face dahua, and it only does 15 degrees up.

I guess you can always flip em upside down, just dont be shocked when the PTZ controls are all wonkey, i doubt anyone really tested it :)
 
Exactly. I can't think of any that go +30 up. +10 yes. +15 on your Dahua is quite good for uptilt. I won't say there aren't any that go +30 but I can't remember seeing them.
 
Those cheap table top ptz can also be mounted to the ceiling and all controls/pictures reversed.

But yeah without confirmation the cam supports it internally, BI can reverse the controls/picture but it does use a few more cycles to do it.

You could always mount it on a wedge but then the angles would arch from side to side, highest in the middle.
 
Yep, but those indoor tabletop jobbies don't have the 10-20x optical zoom the OP wanted. At least none of the ones I remember seeing match those specs. Not a bad idea though.

edit- and now you're talking with the double barreled approach. I forgot about those. Those babies need a rocket launcher slaved to the top.
 
at least a laser pointer output to make people think it's armed :)

you can get those roof top gimbals and attach practically any box camera to em.. that might not be a bad investment, one of those with the new IMX178 box camera and a motorized varifocal lens and you got your self a weather watching warrior that'll make the local weatherman jealous :P

for that they gotta give you permission to put it on the roof, i mean common! its advertisement for there building :P
 
Unfortunately, you won't be able to get those exact specs anywhere close to a $300 budget. It would be possible to have one like this made for $600, but I've yet to find anyone offering one for that price....Dahua offers some for $1500 plus that will do it....Some alternatives:

Huisun/Imporx mini ptz: Price is right and exceptional image quality, decent amount of horizontal pan range....Cons: limited tilt range (10 degrees upward ((or downward if mounted upside down))), no slow shutter, no wiper, no wide zoom range (4x starts wide but doesn't zoom in much, 10X zooms in a good bit but doesn't start at a very wide angle)

Huisun/Imporx dome: Same as the mini ptz, except it adds more optical zoom, will spin 360 degrees and adds a wiper...Cost is a bit higher.

Dahua dome: There is one Dahua dome (I believe in the $600 range) that's been out for a few years that will tilt up to 20 degrees above the horizon. It also offers slow shutter...Downside being that there's no wiper and the daytime image quality doesn't seem quite as good as you get with the newer sensors like you get in the Huisun/Imporx, though still "good enough" for weather purposes.
 
my black face dahua (both big and small) has the exact same CMOS sensor as Huisun, so the image quality.. day or night is pretty much the same.. except my black face has alot more powerfull IR on it so it performs better at night.
 
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