Request thoughts on camera placement/location at a gate

[Virga]

Request thoughts on camera placement/location at a gate.
Please see attached images.
01_ is view from outside looking in.
The pictured gate is an outswing pasture gate and would be replaced by two-leaf inswing gates.
02_ is view from inside, looking out.
At the right is a power panel, and it has a conduit for ethernet cable, just about the max for an ethernet run.
03_ is the site, outside is at bottom of image, inside at top, and most of the arriving and departing traffic will be from the right.
Road to left is a dead-end.
We could assume that upon arriving from outside, there will be a goose-neck type pole on the left side of the apron, with a keypad control.
Quiet street.

 

[samplenhold]

One can't give you a recommendation until you state the purpose of the cam. What are you trying to capture? What will the lighting be?

 

[mat200]

Request thoughts on camera placement/location at a gate.
Please see attached images.
01_ is view from outside looking in.
The pictured gate is an outswing pasture gate and would be replaced by two-leaf inswing gates.
02_ is view from inside, looking out.
At the right is a power panel, and it has a conduit for ethernet cable, just about the max for an ethernet run.
03_ is the site, outside is at bottom of image, inside at top, and most of the arriving and departing traffic will be from the right.
Road to left is a dead-end.
We could assume that upon arriving from outside, there will be a goose-neck type pole on the left side of the apron, with a keypad control.
Quiet street.

Welcome virga

I would be planning several cameras at a front gate like that to cover various functional requirements I could expect to have.

Getting power and data lines to both sides of the entrance would be a big part of this plan.

 

[bigredfish]

One can't give you a recommendation until you state the purpose of the cam. What are you trying to capture? What will the lighting be?

^^^^^
This

 

[Virga]

@samplenhold , @mat200, @bigredfish ... thanks for the responses.
The purpose would be general awareness of comings and goings, especially in real time to open the gate for those who are OK.
Most activity would be during daylight.
There may be lighting at gate, or not.
LPR and face recognition not particularly important, so far anyways.
Given the residential character of the road, multiple cameras might look/feel odd.
There are multiple conduits under the concrete so can get data and power to the other side.
Am thinking of installing a pole for a camera on the left from the outside.
Perhaps on the inside.
Anything is possible.
Edit: Now I'm thinking may be a camera surface-mounted on the pillar itself, and perhaps a camera on either side because this way the cams would blend in better than if they were on poles.
Can get wire to cam through inside of pillar - construction is hollow concrete blocks with stone veneer.

 

[bigredfish]

Scenarios- which is more aligned with your goals?

Vehicle enters, stops at keypad, is admitted. Assaults homeowner, drives back out

Police - “do you have video?” You, “sure”.
A- it was a white car, looks like mebbe a Toyota, I think they guy was wearing a blue shirt
Or
B- You “ yes, here’s a close up of the car, face of driver, and license plate number “

If A then a single wide angle 3.6mm or 2.8mm camera, very close above keypad, much like you see at a drive thru window

If B then same camera as above, plus a LPR camera facing inside to capture plates entering.
Personally I’d add a PTZ facing the entrance to track vehicles and/or humans on foot and as a backup plate camera for exiting vehicles that in addition to its primary tracking role, zooms to a plate capture point as dictated by the inbound plate cam (doubling as a spotter cam) when it detects a vehicle heading outbound.

This is the setup I have at the single entrance to our neighborhood except no gate/keypad

 

[mat200]

For a start

1) minimum 2 cameras, one on each side of the entrance way.

Personally, with all the challenges during Covid, I now believe having two cameras on both sides of a driveway are needed. ( most driveways are short, so 2 cameras - one on each side of the garage door work well here ).

2) Key pad, can get a camera that does a straight on facial image capture ( thinking of this similar to my front door camera's function of "who is knocking on my door" ?

3) LPR camera(s)

Depending on your State, you may only have rear license plates .. so placement needs to be planned for this.


If you are concerned about people seeing too many cameras, you can "hide cameras in plain sight" well enough.
( for example on a house, just painting cameras to match the house helps blend them in )

 

[Virga]

We must be on the right track the number of cameras has grown from the initial one cam to now three cams and counting.
Now I am beginning to see a cam on the control pedestal, and one each on the pillar – maybe more.
Initially I was camera-shy about a slew of cameras on poles that would make people wonder just what is going on there (nothing).
On top of the pillars and/or on brackets off the pillars, are currently feasible locations, in this developing situation.
Once inside the gate, I can install additional cameras on short poles or on trees.
On these assumptions, what might be initial specific candidate cameras? … so I can start thinking about them in real terms.
Wiring: Probably 50-70 feet from cam PoE switch 01 to cam PoE switch 02, then a 325 or so foot hop to cam PoE switch #03 on the power panel near the gate.
Cameras under contemplation would connect to cam PoE switch #03 and should all be within feasible distance.

 

[bigredfish]

Generally speaking the 5442 series 4MP 1/1.8” sensor is the current standard. Best mix of day and night image a good selection of lens and form factor

WizMind S Series - Dahua International

WizMind S Series

www.dahuasecurity.com

 

[wittaj]

Most people are oblivious to cameras.

See this thread for the commonly recommended cameras (along with Amazon links) based on distance to IDENTIFY that represent the overall best value in terms of price and performance day and night.

The Importance of Focal Length over MP in camera selection

 

[bigredfish]

^^^
This

But there can also be a deterrent factor

 

[Virga]

@wittaj ... thanks ... my current (modest) fleet of cameras is off that list, though I went off-list and added a couple of Hik 180 degree 2-lens stitched-image cams which have turned out to be great.

See sample attached – I never tire of looking at images from this cam 325-plus feet from pillars, through a window, still on a "temporary" mount on a DSLR tripod.
Same gate pillars as first post, inside looking out, left pillar obstructed.
Zoom is maxed out, cam still at default settings.
Can manually read a LP on a departing vehicle, haven't tried LPR so far.
Towards bottom right a side view of the power panel, where a 4x4 box in side view is discernible.
I just took it off the live view.
This stuff never gets old, no wonder we are all here.

 

[samplenhold]

So if this way my place, this is what I would do. But realize I LIKE cams. You could get by with less, but I have found that having more than one cam to cover a position never hurts.


So your intent is to place a pole with a call box on the left side. They have call boxes with a cam as part of the box. But if not, I would use Dahua T54IR-ZE cams in positions A, B, and C.

Cam A would be pointing towards the road that would catch the front plate and front of a car coming in as well as the rear plate of one leaving.
Cam B would be facing to the right mounted above the call box that would capture the face of anyone accessing the call box.
Cam C would be facing up the driveway which would capture the rear plate and rear of the car going in as well as the front plate and front of the car going out.



For the inside I would place a Dahua T54IR-ZE cam in position D on the backside of the pillar pointing up the driveway. Captures the rear plate and rea of the car going in as well as the front plate and front of the car going out. The nice part about this cam is that it will not be noticed until they are leaving. So even if they disable the cams outside the gate, you still have this one that probably will not be noticed until it is too late.

For added coverage, a pole with two cams (E and F) could be placed to the right. One cam looking back at the gate and one cam looking up the driveway. Again the coming and going front/rear plates and car views as before. Depending on the distance and how far off the road you place it, either T54IR-ZE cams or B54IR-Z4E cams would work nicely.

You could set a flood light on the inside pole that is set to go on when the gate is opened at night. This would get good car info and coming on so long before the cars enter would not wash out the cams views. That might allow you to set the D-F cams in full color at night.

 

[mat200]

So if this way my place, this is what I would do. But realize I LIKE cams. You could get by with less, but I have found that having more than one cam to cover a position never hurts.

View attachment 196693
So your intent is to place a pole with a call box on the left side. They have call boxes with a cam as part of the box. But if not, I would use Dahua T54IR-ZE cams in positions A, B, and C.

Cam A would be pointing towards the road that would catch the front plate and front of a car coming in as well as the rear plate of one leaving.
Cam B would be facing to the right mounted above the call box that would capture the face of anyone accessing the call box.
Cam C would be facing up the driveway which would capture the rear plate and rear of the car going in as well as the front plate and front of the car going out.

View attachment 196694

For the inside I would place a Dahua T54IR-ZE cam in position D on the backside of the pillar pointing up the driveway. Captures the rear plate and rea of the car going in as well as the front plate and front of the car going out. The nice part about this cam is that it will not be noticed until they are leaving. So even if they disable the cams outside the gate, you still have this one that probably will not be noticed until it is too late.

For added coverage, a pole with two cams (E and F) could be placed to the right. One cam looking back at the gate and one cam looking up the driveway. Again the coming and going front/rear plates and car views as before. Depending on the distance and how far off the road you place it, either T54IR-ZE cams or B54IR-Z4E cams would work nicely.

You could set a flood light on the inside pole that is set to go on when the gate is opened at night. This would get good car info and coming on so long before the cars enter would not wash out the cams views. That might allow you to set the D-F cams in full color at night.

and I would also add a camera to the other side of the driveway from ABC point, to capture potentially the passenger side of the car ..

 

[Virga]

@samplenhold and @mat200 I was looking for input with this kind of specificity, thank you.

 

[samplenhold]

As always, I would get one of the T54IR-ZE cams first and do some testing before you run everything and buy the other cams.

 

[Ri22o]

Initially I was camera-shy about a slew of cameras on poles that would make people wonder just what is going on there (nothing).

Surveillance/security cameras are in use everywhere to protect businesses and no one questions them, but you put them on/around your house to protect you, your family, and your property and people question it. It makes no sense.

If someone questions it, ask them why they have an issue with it at your property but not when they go to the grocery store.

 

[Virga]

Surveillance/security cameras are in use everywhere to protect businesses and no one questions them, but you put them on/around your house to protect you, your family, and your property and people question it. It makes no sense.

If someone questions it, ask them why they have an issue with it at your property but not when they go to the grocery store.

Recently a person was walking with a dog on our road, dog leash in one hand and beverage cup in the other.
I sent a Z12E image to a neighbor and asked if they recognized the person, and they said no.
Next time I saw that neighbor on the road they said they were talking at dinner the night before that now that I’m stalking them, they too need to get cameras.
Not long ago, the same person cheerfully told me that when my house was being built their son was on my property and managed to leave just as I drove down the road. (I did “catch” papa bear driving out of my driveway another time). They also told me that when another neighbor’s house was being built (that would have been a decade prior) they used to drive over on their quads to play around the construction site.
So, being vigilant and viewing my own property with cameras is “stalking” (we each own up to the center line of the road and give each other a right of way).
But their entering and trespassing upon neighbors’ property is a fun filled family activity, and a whole new generation of youngsters grew up thinking this is normal.

 

[mat200]

Recently a person was walking with a dog on our road, dog leash in one hand and beverage cup in the other.
I sent a Z12E image to a neighbor and asked if they recognized the person, and they said no.
Next time I saw that neighbor on the road they said they were talking at dinner the night before that now that I’m stalking them, they too need to get cameras.
Not long ago, the same person cheerfully told me that when my house was being built their son was on my property and managed to leave just as I drove down the road. (I did “catch” papa bear driving out of my driveway another time). They also told me that when another neighbor’s house was being built (that would have been a decade prior) they used to drive over on their quads to play around the construction site.
So, being vigilant and viewing my own property with cameras is “stalking” (we each own up to the center line of the road and give each other a right of way).
But their entering and trespassing upon neighbors’ property is a fun filled family activity, and a whole new generation of youngsters grew up thinking this is normal.

A lot of boys like to see construction sites .. question is do they do something harmful or just check it out ?

In the future some of those boys will make good civil engineers .. and the ones that stole stuff good congressmen

 

[Ri22o]

Recently a person was walking with a dog on our road, dog leash in one hand and beverage cup in the other.
I sent a Z12E image to a neighbor and asked if they recognized the person, and they said no.
Next time I saw that neighbor on the road they said they were talking at dinner the night before that now that I’m stalking them, they too need to get cameras.
Not long ago, the same person cheerfully told me that when my house was being built their son was on my property and managed to leave just as I drove down the road. (I did “catch” papa bear driving out of my driveway another time). They also told me that when another neighbor’s house was being built (that would have been a decade prior) they used to drive over on their quads to play around the construction site.
So, being vigilant and viewing my own property with cameras is “stalking” (we each own up to the center line of the road and give each other a right of way).
But their entering and trespassing upon neighbors’ property is a fun filled family activity, and a whole new generation of youngsters grew up thinking this is normal.

My neighbor across the street has made her comments, faces, noises, etc, but you know if something were to happen she wouldn't hesitate to come and ask me to look for evidence.