New Home - Please advise on camera/NVR selection for a POE Newbie

[cerebra]

Hey everyone,
I've been reading a lot of the threads here and have learned a lot from the good information that abounds. However, it seems the more I read, the more complicated things seem to get so I'm hoping I can lay out what I'm looking to do, put some initial ideas I have out there, and get feedback from y'all on what would be better, or what mistakes I might be making. Any and all help is appreciated!

Here's what I'm currently thinking:
Outside:
- Front of house: 2 cameras, one at each corner of front porch.
- Back of house: 1 camera at back left corner, pointing to yard to see kids.
- Side: Driveway - 1 camera pointing to where cars are parked.

Inside:
- Kids rooms: 2 total cameras.
- Living room: 1 camera

NVR:
- Torn between POE and non-POE as I see benefits, downsides of each. I need at least 8 chan, but would consider 16 for bandwidth increases.

Seller:
- Feel like I'm rolling the dice with whatever option I chose, from Amazon to the shippers in China who I hope will send the appropriate product with the english version of the firmware.


Specific Cameras:
Regarding the outside cameras, there's an overhang all can be mounted under so I'm torn between bullet and dome versions. Does anyone have a reason I should go with one over the other? Regarding specific cameras, I'm considering:
Dome: DS-2CD2332-I
Bullet: DS-2CD2232-I5

For the indoor cameras, I was considering this one: DS-2CD2432F-IW but I don't like the 10m night vision. I do like the smaller profile.

For the NVR, I'd like to do the non-POE version DS-7816N-E1 but I'm still somewhat unclear regarding the cost of getting a POE switch, and how one communicates directly with the switch to turn on and off the cameras.


Again, this is a very early list and collection of ideas that I'd love to work through with members of the forum who'd be willing to help a new guy out who loves to learn. I'm good with technology, and good with networking, so I'm not intimidated by anything on that side, but I do know enough to be honest that I'm not 100% clear on the end-to-end solution here, in terms of which wires I'll need, which cameras work best, switches, etc. Any help is appreciated!

 

[bp2008]

Hello.

The DS-2CD2432F-IW is a great choice for indoors. I have one above my kitchen cabinets and find the infrared to be more than sufficient.

I can personally vouch for the DS-2CD2332-I. It is great outdoors. One thing that was a bit annoying is it was a bit tricky to mount on my vinyl siding because once screwed down tight there was not enough room to properly attach the little plastic ring that hides the base of the camera. Not really a big deal, but bullet cameras are generally easier to mount.

The DS-2CD2232-I5 is a good choice of bullet camera. Perhaps a little large and probably more expensive than a 2032, but the extra infrared power may be worth it

For wires/cables:

Look for cat5e or cat6 cable. The wire should be pure copper (NOT CCA - Copper Clad Aluminum. CCA is poorer quality). Some cables do not specify either way, and I would not trust them.

Switches:

There are two types of switch. Managed and unmanaged. Most managed PoE switches allow you to log in to the switch and remotely power individual ports on and off. Unmanaged switches are cheaper and do not let you do this. This $45 unmanaged model is very popular: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B003CFATT2

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If you are worried about buying from China directly, you can always shop from http://www.nellyssecurity.com/ or from http://wrightwoodsurveillance.com/ or you can talk to the user milkisbad on this forum, as he works for a different seller in the USA and will gladly sell to you. Whenever milk's products are on sale, he usually has the best prices. And he is very responsive in case you need help.

 

[bubba123]

I second the DS-2CD2332-I. I have 4 of them (US-based versions, bought of Amazon) with similar locations as you. I'm using 5.1.6 and taking advantage of multiple plane traversal areas to minimize false alarms. I mount them under the eaves and have CAT6 running to those locations. Make sure you run CAT6 to all corner eve locations; I didn't - I ran one to one corner and had to end up buying another POE switch for the attic to split off those connections. The other thing I added was a chase from my attic to my crawl space so I can run new CAT6 cables should I need to. I'm not using a DVR; I attached an external drive to a raspberrypi and using that as a NAS to save videos. Captures get taken care of by the app I wrote based on if I'm home or not (see my sig).

 

[cerebra]

Couple of follow-up questions (thanks for the replies):
BP2008:
1) Would I need two of those switches you listed to power 8 POE cameras?
2) Do you have any recommendations on appropriate Cat6 cables?
(Also, I think your reference to the size of the camera I preferred actually has pushed me back to considering the 2032 - i know my wife doesn't want our home looking like some type of cyber-security headquarters.)

Bubba123:
1) Why do you recommend running Cat6 to all corner eve locations? Are you saying to do that for future expansion so you don't have to run it again, or are there other reasons?
2) What is an attic chase? I searched google but am still somewhat unclear on what you mean.

Also, does anyone know of any good tutorials on running cables through the attic to mount these cameras? I've never run cables like these and I want to do it right (ensure I seal the holes properly, weatherproof the connections, etc). Any videos y'all would recommend reviewing before I take this on?

 

[bubba123]

I was assuming you were building, I'd go ahead and run cables up there in case you decide the locations were wrong and you want to move them. Cat 5e or 6 would be fine.

Attic chase or conduit, it's essentially a flex tube running from the attic all the way down to the crawl space so I can fish wires from up top to down below, then up into my com closet on the 1st floor (I have conduit going from crawl space up to it too). For later expansion like antennas, fiber, speakers, etc. http://www.theconstructionacademy.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/06/Home-Network-Panel-Conduit-Attic.jpg

 

[bp2008]

1) Would I need two of those switches you listed to power 8 POE cameras?

Yes. Each switch has 4 PoE ports, so you would need two of them to power 8 PoE cameras. If you are going to run all the camera cables back to the same location, you might as well get a single switch with 8 PoE ports though. I have recommended this one before but I have not personally used it: http://www.amazon.com/dp/B00H58P8RU The nice thing (besides the price) is that it has an uplink port for you to connect back to your router.

Note that the switches I have recommended are all 10/100 speed, not gigabit. If you want to expand further it would be a good idea to get gigabit speed gear. It is more expensive though. Alternatively you can get 10/100 switches just for the PoE and link them to gigabit gear.

2) Do you have any recommendations on appropriate Cat6 cables?

I have had great experiences with shielded cat6 from Cable Matters (on Amazon.com). The cables are a bit pricey though; you can get unshielded ones quite a bit cheaper. It is easy to find cables through amazon's search box with queries like "shielded cat6 50" to find 50 foot cat6 cables that are shielded. Cable Matters uses pure copper wire and I've never gotten a bad cable from them (or from anyone else for that matter).

If you want to custom-build all your cables, you can keep your drilled holes smaller and not have to deal with piles of extra cable next to your switch. I can strongly recommend Ubiquiti Toughcable. They have two versions... pro and carrier (carrier is the higher grade cable, and also more expensive). Both versions are shielded and UV resistant. It comes on a 1000 foot spool for about $200. Then you need a box of Toughcable connectors for about $50. And also a crimping tool. I am a big fan of the Platinum Tools 100054C but it is pricey at about $75. Cheaper crimpers will do the job but may lead to more frustration

(Also, I think your reference to the size of the camera I preferred actually has pushed me back to considering the 2032 - i know my wife doesn't want our home looking like some type of cyber-security headquarters.)

She would not like my house

 

[Mel42]

"One thing that was a bit annoying is it was a bit tricky to mount on my vinyl siding because once screwed down tight there was not enough room to properly attach the little plastic ring that hides the base of the camera. Not really a big deal, but bullet cameras are generally easier to mount."

I have found that these work very well for mounting the 2332 on vinyl siding

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Cellwood-6-625-in-x-6-625-in-White-D4-and-D5-Surface-Mounting-Block-BLK040H04H/202674773?N=5yc1vZbye2

 

[bp2008]

Nice! I will have to remember that!