Dahua keeps rebooting

[sebastiantombs]

I just did a quick search and the PoE+ injectors I see are not 12VDC input, either line voltage or 30VAC inputs, So the choice comes down to to batteries or add another DC power cable in parallel and cut the voltage drop in half. Keep in mind you can "tap" 12VDC off of one battery to power the devices that only require 12VDC at the battery location.

 

[NLAnaconda]

Thanks for checking. Then I hope that going for 2 batteries and 24v wil work . Going to try that.

Didnt know I could tap 12v from 1 battery.

Few questions remain:

1. Does it also drain that one battery a little quicker because of the router and arduino are added load to that single battery, while that same battery is also part of the 24v setup? Or do they level out?

2. Am I right that by using 2 batteries will (roughly) double the operating time?

 

[tigerwillow1]

A 12 volt POE injector would make matters worse, running the same current you draw now on smaller wires. Using a POE switch to supply cameras power would send nominal 48 volts down the wire, and the higher voltage is the key to reduced current on the wire and less loss.

 

[sebastiantombs]

If you like I'll sketch something up for a connection guide of sorts. You can "balance" the 12VDC load between the two batteries simply bay attaching one device to one battery and the other device to the other battery. While that's not particularly elegant it will balance the load more equally and discharge them both at closer to the same rates.

As far as doubling the operating time it will definitely increase by a large factor but probably not really double. I'd guess by a factor of 1.75x or higher but not getting to 2x.

 

[NLAnaconda]

Thanks. Would be awesome. Learning a lot here

Im happy with 1,75x.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Here you go. Sorry it's kind of crude, but the idea is easy to see. Just be careful to observe polarity.

 

[NLAnaconda]

@sebastiantombs very clear! That is what it is going to be. Thanks! Much appreciated!!

 

[Teken]

Lots of folks have offered valuable feedback already but would like to stress a few things if only to benefit future readers. Any off grid camera system is always powered by a 24 VDC battery. The batteries are always AGM / LiFePO and never a standard SLA automotive battery and not even a Golf cart deep cycle battery. Over sizing the wiring to all components is needed where extreme temperatures will be seen like it is outdoors.

As you noted voltage drop can and will be present along with increased current when its colder vs warmer days.

The quality of cable used must be outdoor rated and this is easily seen for anyone who has ever tried to use that old school clear speaker wire - outdoors. You'll quickly see the copper wiring begin to turn green and tarnish. This is literally rust and that is seen as voltage drop within the cable (more resistance) which we haven't even addressed the cable length!

All cables must be as short as possible to reduce voltage drop . . .

No where do I see a fuse at the positive side of the battery or anywhere else??

A fuse must be within 6 inches of the positive terminal and one at any hardware component. It's extremely remote to ever see a off grid system with no method to recharge the battery cells like it is in your current deployment. It costs you nothing to run a super long wire to to a solar panel with a charge controller to regulate the charging of the batteries.

Which leads to the fact there must be a device which terminates the power draw based on a defined voltage threshold. Even the best battery in the world will die a early life and not offer you the expected service life. Every battery no matter the chemistry or design has a DOD or depth of discharge and the number of cycles it can provide usable field service.

A generally speaking a standard SLA battery does not provide the same amount of capacity in a linear fashion. Meaning a 12 volt cell at 12.90 is considered (100%) full vs 12.0 is essentially (0%) or dead. Typically SLA batteries can only endure 50% DOD and offer less than 500 cycles.

Bottom line you need to replenish these cells using a solar panel with a charge controller. You need to incorporate a voltage cut off Regulator so the batteries will not be damaged or see shorten service life due to being depleted which impacts its cycle life. If your region see's colder climates like I do its imperative that the battery box be well insulated as the battery will drop in voltage just by external temperatures!

Lastly, the ideal battery configuration is series - parallel which increases voltage and ampacity. Obviously this hinges upon the type of cells, AH rating, etc etc. But, the reality is if anyone intends to do the same all of the above must be considered to even have a chance of success!

 

[NLAnaconda]

Thanks @Teken As your post might read as a bit demotivating (everything is wrong ) it is good value.
It is a hobby project. Every now and then I come up with ideas and just try to go for it, making millions of mistakes and learn a lot from it. It's more fun than theory in the school banks. Thats what I like and this is no exception.
Two months ago I build a drone and now this came up my mind .

So the other day I walked the dog in a canyon and found a whole lot of animal tracks. I thought... could it be possible to build a live / ptz / ir camera here and see whats going on. No experience at all so I just started googling. There is no power and no internet so I tried to accomplish that.
Anyway, you know the state where it is in now and it evolves into something that works. Probably not according to official standards but hey.. every next step is a step in learning new stuff.

So about your post...

Any off grid camera system is always powered by a 24 VDC battery.

Why always? The Foscam worked perfect on 12V? I bet this one would also work if that super long powerline was not in between.

The batteries are always AGM / LiFePO and never a standard SLA automotive battery and not even a Gold cart deep cycle battery.

Could you explain why? Shop told me this battery could do the job (and it did so far).

Over sizing the wiring to all components is needed where extreme temperatures will be seen like it is outdoors.

Agree on this one. I did not know anything about wires but I learned the hard way. The reason is wires have resistance, a lot more then I thought.

The quality of cable used must be outdoor rated

Pfew, something I did right.

No where do I see a fuse at the positive side of the battery or anywhere else??

There is a fuse, the voltage regulator has one. Battery => Voltage Regulator.

It's extremely remote to ever see a off grid system with no method to recharge the battery cells like it is in your current deployment. It costs you nothing to run a super long wire to to a solar panel with a charge controller to regulate the charging of the batteries.

Well it costs a solar pannel right? But I'm thinking of adding a solar panel instead of 2 extra batteries. It is probably the same costs.

If your region see's colder climates like I do its imperative that the battery box be well insulated as the battery will drop in voltage just be external temperatures!

Well the current temperatures are the most extreme in 5 years. It is global news. Normally temps below -5 are (very) rare. But yes now we have had a snow storm.

So in conclusion....
What you say (besides, stop the maddness ) is: Get a solar panel and a charge controller, put the batteries in serie, an undervoltage protection, and I might have a (very tiny ) change of success?

 

[Teken]

Thanks @Teken As your post might read as a bit demotivating (everything is wrong ) it is good value.
It is a hobby project. Every now and then I come up with ideas and just try to go for it, making millions of mistakes and learn a lot from it. It's more fun than theory in the school banks. Thats what I like and this is no exception.
Two months ago I build a drone and now this came up my mind .

So the other day I walked the dog in a canyon and found a whole lot of animal tracks. I thought... could it be possible to build a live / ptz / ir camera here and see whats going on. No experience at all so I just started googling. There is no power and no internet so I tried to accomplish that.
Anyway, you know the state where it is in now and it evolves into something that works. Probably not according to official standards but hey.. every next step is a step in learning new stuff.

So about your post...


Why always? The Foscam worked perfect on 12V? I bet this one would also work if that super long powerline was not in between.


Could you explain why? Shop told me this battery could do the job (and it did so far).


Agree on this one. I did not know anything about wires but I learned the hard way. The reason is wires have resistance, a lot more then I thought.


Pfew, something I did right.


There is a fuse, the voltage regulator has one. Battery => Voltage Regulator.


Well it costs a solar pannel right? But I'm thinking of adding a solar panel instead of 2 extra batteries. It is probably the same costs.


Well the current temperatures are the most extreme in 5 years. It is global news. Normally temps below -5 are (very) rare. But yes now we have had a snow storm.

So in conclusion....
What you say (besides, stop the maddness ) is: Get a solar panel and a charge controller, put the batteries in serie, an undervoltage protection, and I might have a (very tiny ) change of success?

LOL

First, we all learn by doing and you Sir have done quite well so far.

RE: 24 vs 12 VDC -> Generally speaking using a higher line voltage reduces the need for thicker wire and reduced current. But from a powering stand point normally we like to see all hardware be 24 VDC powered such as Access Points / PTP this maintains efficiency. Regardless, when a system is wired for 24 VDC this offers the end device a larger margin of operation before it will cut off. This obviously assumes the buck converter or step down transformer has limited loss. Meaning a 24 VDC battery system using an efficient 12 VDC converter will offer the required 12.8 VDC voltage to keep the hardware running within its operating range. Almost all hardware from Dahua / Hikvision specific a 5% margin of operations using POE / 12 VDC. This assumes best case scenarios that are in its best case operating temperature range.

RE: Fuse -> a voltage regulator or anything else is not a supplement to a inline fuse. This fuse is to protect the wire which must be within 6 inches from the positive battery terminal. Any other fusible link, PTC, glass fuse, ATC fuse must be present to protect the related hardware. One is to protect the wiring vs the other is to protect the hardware.

RE: SPD -> If you have any length of cable running into your home it must be shielded cable to allow proper grounding. This is followed by proper use of a SPD Surge Protective Device to reduce a voltage rise in the line from damaging electronics in your home.

RE: Charge Controller -> First, you will never wire anything directly to a battery in a off grid application. Everything must be powered and managed by the charge controller via its output load. Even the cheapest AliExpress blue light special incorporates a fuse, voltage limit, and output limit. Meaning just a single box would have protected the battery from being fully depleted (low voltage) condition. It would have also charged the battery to maintain its reliability and long term performance without you ever having to trek into the forest each day, week to do a battery change.

This of course assumes the solar panel is in place to supply power to the charge controller and than to the primary cells.

Lastly, my initial reply to you was intended to highlight Best Practices so others who may stumble upon this thread - would know what to consider.

Rock On . . .

 

[NLAnaconda]

Haha thanks, appreciate the info!

 

[Old Timer]

Sounds like you pretty well got it figured out while I was out of pocket.
I would put a fuse at the battery, and if you run an device off of each battery, you will need a fuse in each of those circuits.
By using 2 batteries, you will increase your time between charges, you just need to make sure it does not run it too low.
If you get a solar cell, look for one with high enough voltage to be able to charge a 24 volt system. Your charge controller
will need to have the correct float voltage for your batteries, and a low voltage cut off to protect your batteries from
going too far down to recharge.
This site has a lot of information on off grid power

Home Power Magazine | Downloadable Archive | Home

An archive of the complete 31-year history of Home Power magazine. 188 digital back issues capture a three decade history of the renewable energy movement in the U.S. and beyond. Each issue is available for non-commercial use at no cost to registered members of this site.

www.homepower.com

 

[NLAnaconda]

Hi guys,

Here I am again with the next version of the project .

So.. What @Teken said, you need a charging method on site otherwise the batteries die like snowflakes in summer.
In the next version I would like to add a solar panel. But after a day googling a lot (serious a lot) of information came at me. I think I have some kind of plan that might work, but you are so much further in knowledge with it I hope you can check it and give some tips.

For what I've read I need a MPPT charger. Which requires a load, battery and solar panel.



So this is the idea:

Solar panel: Eco Delta 310WP

Rated power	310Wp
Efficiency	18.4%
Voltage at Maximum Power VMPP	32.97 V
Current at Maximum Power IMPP	9.41 A
Open Circuit Voltage VOC	40.27 V
Short Circuit Current ISC	9.94 A
Power Tolerance Positive	+ 3 %
Maximum System Voltage	1500 V
Maximum Fuse Rating	15 A

Batteries: 2x 100AH SEMI-TRACTIE ACCU JBE YELLOW LINE 12V, 720A
(I already have these)

Load:
Camera: Dahua SD49425XB-HNR (12V, max 23W, avg 12W)
4G Router: Teltonika RUT 240 (12V, max 6.5W)
Arduino Uno: almost nothing (30mA)
(with two 24V => 12V converters)

MPPT: Victron Smart Solar MPPT 75/15 (12V/24V-15A)

Could this work?
I can get two of those solar panels if required. But I prefer to use one.

 

[sebastiantombs]

I'm nit a solar expert, but if you get generally sunny skies one should do the trick...I think.

 

[NLAnaconda]

Yes, I think it will do the trick. As far as I have read I will get some downtime in the winter but only a couple of days per year. That is no problem. It is more like... will this setup work. And is this smarter to do.

 

[sebastiantombs]

Definitely smarter to do, controlled charge and discharge is actually pretty important as well as the protection it adds for the equipment.