Advice on new Dahua setup without NVR

G

Gavin Ward

n3wb
Apr 8, 2019
4
6
Ireland
Hi everyone

I am planning a system to monitor a barn where cows that are about to calve and happened across this forum.

My main conclusions so far are:
  • Don't buy some cheap no name camera (I heard good things about Dahua)
  • Don't buy a good name camera but with Chinese firmware
  • Eyeball type cameras better than domes or turrets
  • Two of these probably better use of money than one cheap PTZ
The shed has fairly bright lighting and this is often left on when a cow is in overnight so extreme low light ability is not required but seems a nice to have.

I was looking at these two both of which seem to have their advantages

IPC-HDW2231R-ZS 2MP Starlight IR Eyeball Network Camera 2.7~13.5mm varifocal lens

IPC-HFW1831E 8MP WDR IR Mini Bullet Network Camera

For the indoors part of the plan my intention was to use either an android app (there seem to be plenty) or maybe a raspberry Pi dedicated to receving the H.264 stream, connected to a television.

The idea would be to get up in the night to look at it without having to go outside. (Sadly none of them seem to include hoof detection as a feature)

No recording is required, nor does it need to be accessible beyond my LAN.

I dropped Andy from Empiretech a line to see if he could ship here (he can) but he mentioned he wasn't sure about the watching the streams on VLC aspect of the plan. Rather than ask him to elaborate I thought I'd ask what you guys think about this?

I don't seriously need to buy a network DVR for this do I? Is there any issue with accessing the RTSP stream (with audio) from a URL? I was under the impression this was a totally normal and common use of these cameras.

Also the camera is covering an area about 5m² and would anticipate mounting cameras on the corners. Does a 6mm focal length sound right for this?

What is important that it once configured it "just works" but I have no problem with doing some config when setting it up.

Thanks everyone for your help. I have an irrational interest in IP cameras now.
 
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Hi my Irish friend... The IPC-HDW2231R-ZS would be a good choice, nice trade off with low light and day light regarding picture quality.
If you are just connecting the camera direct to your LAN then you have a few choices..
And with the variable focal length you can test which is best for you all the way up to 13.5mm :)

1) If you have a tablet you could install the "gDMSS Plus" app on your iPad / Android device and just watch the stream live.
2) The same can be done from a laptop / desktop by installing the Windows based app onto your device.
3) I haven't tried this yet, but... With the new firmware revision (posted on this forum) you can view the camera interface / live view within Chrome / IE / Edge without needing a plugin so you may be able to launch it from the browser on a smart TV. (Like I said haven't tried it yet (TV wise) yet)
4) Like you mentioned install Ubuntu on the PI and view it from the browser within there.
5) Again with new firmware you can enable "RTMP" and live stream to YouTube so others can watch them cows ;) (Internet connecting needed Obvs)

As for @EMPIRETECANDY and Andy.. you can trust him all the way :wave:
 
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I can say that you can view the stream from a 2231R-ZS from a "modern" browser if the firmware is upgraded. The 2231 is a very good, relatively low cost, camera with good day and night performance.
 
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Gavin Ward said:
(Sadly none of them seem to include hoof detection as a feature)
Click to expand...
I'll keep an eye out for that in future firmware releases. :)

Gavin Ward said:
Also the camera is covering an area about 5m² and would anticipate mounting cameras on the corners. Does a 6mm focal length sound right for this?
Click to expand...
Is it a square room? If you mount in a corner and want a view of the entire room, it's more common to go with 2.8/3.6mm. A 6mm lens would have more zoom (so what it's pointing directly at would be larger), but it would have less width, so you might not get all of the image to the left and right of what it's pointing directly at.

Looking at the specs for this camera, here are the angle of views.
2.8mm: 111°
4.0mm: 87°
6.0mm: 55°

Gavin Ward said:
I have an irrational interest in IP cameras now.
Click to expand...
That tends to happen around here.
 
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That's another advantage of the 2231. It's a varifocal and can be set to whatever focal length works for the installation when installed. Keep in mind that varifocal is not quite the same as zoom in that varifocal is designed to be set and left at the needed focal length and not be zoomed in and out on a regular basis like an actual zoom camera.
 
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Thank you everybody for your very helpful responses. The varifocal feature definitely seems of use to me. I noticed the 2231 doesn't have audio though and I think that would be interesting to play with so I have chosen the 5231 instead which seems to be substantially similar, but with audio. I just ordered the one camera for now as I might learn something useful from setting it up that would influence my choice of second camera. Inevitably the cow will choose to sit with her business end away from the camera so a second one is likely to be needed at some point.

I'm using a powerline extender for this specific purpose and it only has a single ethernet port so no harm to keep things simple to begin with. All going well, I'll hopefully be back in a few weeks with some cow footage.
 
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Gavin, I know what you mean about an irrational interest; I am simply a civilian lurker around here, but I gather, there are simple converter boxes 'AHD to HDMI' that appear to make a direct 'Camera to monitor' connection - the basics anyway. I am not sure about your list of add-ons. Cheers.

Jim
 
JImCan said:
Gavin, I know what you mean about an irrational interest; I am simply a civilian lurker around here, but I gather, there are simple converter boxes 'AHD to HDMI' that appear to make a direct 'Camera to monitor' connection - the basics anyway. I am not sure about your list of add-ons. Cheers.

Jim
Click to expand...

Thanks Jim. My understanding is that AHD is the other (cheaper) type of camera that is not IP based so I don't think a simple adapter would work for the camera I have chosen. I have extended my ethernet network out to the shed with a pair ofthesewhich were just £15 on amazon before christmas and seem to work well (no dropped packets).

If I had an analogue camera, I would have been needing to run a new cable for it whereas this way, I can use the existing mains wiring and potentially view it from anywhere covered by the wi-fi. I can also put a wireless access point in the shed.

Would anticipate using an android app as the viewer but I think a Raspberry Pi should be perfectly workable too and they have an HDMI out. I'd be happy with the former, my father may prefer having it on the TV.
 
awsum140 said:
That's another advantage of the 2231. It's a varifocal and can be set to whatever focal length works for the installation when installed. Keep in mind that varifocal is not quite the same as zoom in that varifocal is designed to be set and left at the needed focal length and not be zoomed in and out on a regular basis like an actual zoom camera.
Click to expand...

I'm planning on getting one. I have a 20-30 foot driveway.

Planning on starting with 1-3 cameras -one fort he backyard, one for the front door area and one for the driveway.
Would the 2231 cut it?

And do I need to buy anything else to mount this? I know noob questions.
 
Alan Carter said:
I'm planning on getting one. I have a 20-30 foot driveway.

Planning on starting with 1-3 cameras -one fort he backyard, one for the front door area and one for the driveway.
Would the 2231 cut it?

And do I need to buy anything else to mount this? I know noob questions.
Click to expand...

Have a look at IPVM Camera Calculator V3 and put any type of camera to inspect the DORI parameters. If all the previous sounds chinese to you, read the Cliff Notes :)

And for mounts: tons of possiblities (also available from @EMPIRETECANDY !): hhttps://us.dahuasecurity.com/product-category/accessories/camera-accessories/ from pole mounts, to wall mounts, to heavy duty mounts... But you can make them yourself too (with each cam, you'll get a "sticker" with the drillholes). The advantage is that these cast alu junction boxes are water proof and have pre-made drillholes (I personally got a couple of these: Waterproof Junction Box – Dahua North America). There used to be a "branch" which lead you which junction box is compatible with which cam, but I can't seem to find it quickly, but here's how to know it for sure: select your cam (eg https://us.dahuasecurity.com/product/4k-ir-longdistance-vari-focal-epoe-bullet/) and look down at the accessoires.

Good luck!
CC
 
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Alan Carter said:
I'm planning on getting one. I have a 20-30 foot driveway.

Planning on starting with 1-3 cameras -one fort he backyard, one for the front door area and one for the driveway.
Would the 2231 cut it?

And do I need to buy anything else to mount this? I know noob questions.
Click to expand...

At 20-30 feet the 2231 will do a good job and give you the "who" not just the "what.

Mounting is a case by case thing, what you're looking for for a final look , what the construction is like and how handy you are. Mine are. for the most part, mounted to the soffets with no holes drilled in the soffets. I do have two mounted on trees and used the appropriate box from Dahua for those so I had an easy way to keep the RJ connectors dry. I have one, in a shed, that's simply screwed into a rafter. Think about how and where you want them mounted and how handy, or ambitious, you are :)
 
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Thanks @awsum140 and @catcamstar

You guys are the best! :)

I appreciate that - to be honest, I'm not the most handy character so even reading all the tech notes gets my head in a jam sometimes haha
Thanks very much for the guidance. Appreciate it!
 
One more tip for installing...use a dielectric grease on the RJ connectors. A little dab on the male connector prior to inserting it into the female connector. Just a little dab is needed but can save you going nuts from corrosion getting to the contacts. Apply that, wrap with quality electrical tape and, if you want to go the extra mile, wrap with a self amalgamating electrical tape as well.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000CCIDAA/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
 
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JImCan said:
Gavin, You sent me off in a new direction... Here one of the things I found, in case you had not seen. Thanks. Jim

Video Streaming Raspberry Pi Camera | Random Nerd Tutorials
Click to expand...

In terms of image quality, reliability and flexibility (not to mention ease of installation) there should be no comparison between a dedicated IP camera and a raspberry Pi with a camera board (which I think were £15 when I bought mine but there are now Chinese knockoffs available for even less). However the Pi is great fun to play with and for the cost involved, I think an IP camera enthusiast should have at least one raspberry Pi for comparison. People do put them in camera housings and use them as cameras but I'm not convinced they are the right tool for many serious applications. Capturing photos of birds in your bird box, that sort of stuff they're ideal for.

I was talking about using it on the opposite end, without a camera connected, just as a receiver which it should also be capable of doing reliably. It can decode h.264 in hardware. h265, I don't believe they can do yet.

My Pi cameras have been mostly gathering dust these past few years but I must put them to work at something again. They really are great fun to play with especially over wireless.

There are Chinese imposters of the Raspberry Pi for signiciantly less money too - Orange Pi, Banana Pi, etc. I would advise steering clear. The Raspberry Pi is enough exposure to linux error messages for most people.
 
awsum140 said:
One more tip for installing...use a dielectric grease on the RJ connectors. A little dab on the male connector prior to inserting it into the female connector. Just a little dab is needed but can save you going nuts from corrosion getting to the contacts. Apply that, wrap with quality electrical tape and, if you want to go the extra mile, wrap with a self amalgamating electrical tape as well.

https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B000CCIDAA/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_title_o09_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1
Click to expand...

You are awesome ;) Thanks again
 
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