Criminal spy camera inside Logitech mouse

Into_Oblivion said:
I am asking these questions, to make sure that it can't happen.
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Well, Mossad snuck explosives into pagers and then sold them to Hezbollah, so it 100% can happen. If they wanted to put a camera in your mouse, I bet they could
 
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IReallyLikePizza2 said:
Well, Mossad snuck explosives into pagers and then sold them to Hezbollah, so it 100% can happen. If they wanted to put a camera in your mouse, I bet they could
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But who would need to put it in there? Logitech? And wouldn't the additional, external power and data cables be obvious?
 
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Ri22o said:
But who would need to put it in there? Logitech? And wouldn't the additional, external power and data cables be obvious?
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Same questions could be asked of the pagers
 
When it lists 10x zoom on the box, you know you've done goofed
 
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This was on WFMZ news:
QUAKERTOWN, Pa. - Three former patients are suing a local counseling center and one of its former counselors who police have accused of placing covert cameras disguised as charging blocks to secretly record patients and staff using the bathroom at his Quakertown office.
 
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mat200 said:
Is this a serious question ?

If so, there are many already known attacks that you want to protect against first.

Re the mouse .. buy a new one from a trusted source. Do not buy from Temu .. or RU
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The mouse came from a big vendor / big legitimate shop.

I know, that there is better and more effective ways to hack a system.

I am just using this thread, to make sure, that there is one less hacking-method to worry about.

And that is why I ask my questions.
 
Ri22o said:
You are far more likely to have something installed on your PC that records your screen than you are to have a camera in your mouse recording your screen.
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I am not concerned regarding malware.

"But who would need to put it in there? Logitech?"

A potential hacker

"And wouldn't the additional, external power and data cables be obvious?"

Se my post below regarding this

"If your mouse has USB, HDMI, and 12v connections, there may be a camera in it."

Theoretical and potetianlly, yes



I know, that there is better and more effective ways to hack a system.

I am just using this thread, to make sure, that there is one less hacking-method to worry about.

And that is why I ask my questions.
 
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To me, it seems really difficult and you would need a special set of skills or education, to pull it off.


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Powering the spy camera:

The spy camera has a battery
The battery life would limit the recording time
Or
The mouse powers the spy camera

If the mouse powers it, you somehow need the hardware of the mouse to work together with the spy camera
I am sure, that there is only a limited amount of powering wires inside they mouse, and they are all occupied / used by the mouse

So you somehow need to add more powering wires inside the mouse, while also make it work?

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Hacker access the recordings:

The spy camera either stores the recordings or sends them via some kind of signal to the hacker

This would require a spy camera that has this kind of feature - being able to transmit a signal to the hacker

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Space inside the mouse:

Just the listing above, there is various parts required, and they all take up space


Is there any obstacles / problems I have left out or forgotten?
 
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bp2008 said:
The mouse's USB connection to the computer would be the power source.
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The mouse powers the spy camera

If the mouse powers it, you somehow need the hardware of the mouse to work together with the spy camera
I am sure, that there is only a limited amount of powering wires inside they mouse, and they are all occupied / used by the mouse

So you somehow need to add more powering wires inside the mouse, while also make it work?
I assumme that is quite difficult, and require special skills?

bp2008 said:
Yup there's plenty of room inside a mouse for advanced spy tech. They could even take out the mouse's original guts and put in something smaller to make more room.
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And again, I assumme that is quite difficult, and require special skills?

bp2008 said:
Any sane criminal would just use the mouse as a malicious USB device to install malware. Adding a camera to the mouse would be way more work and way easier to detect.
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Use the MOUSE as the carrier or install hardware inside the mouse carrying the malware?
Because the mouse only holds firmware, and data can't be added to the mouse itself?

That would require specialized malware?
And I assume, that the systems AV would block it.

bp2008 said:
"Or could someone with special skills also install a spy camera inside the mouse?"

Yes.
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Are we talking NSA-level?
Someone that has used years to develop this method?

Thank you for your replies
 
Into_Oblivion said:
The mouse powers the spy camera

If the mouse powers it, you somehow need the hardware of the mouse to work together with the spy camera
I am sure, that there is only a limited amount of powering wires inside they mouse, and they are all occupied / used by the mouse

So you somehow need to add more powering wires inside the mouse, while also make it work?
I assumme that is quite difficult, and require special skills?



And again, I assumme that is quite difficult, and require special skills?



Use the MOUSE as the carrier or install hardware inside the mouse carrying the malware?
Because the mouse only holds firmware, and data can't be added to the mouse itself?

That would require specialized malware?
And I assume, that the systems AV would block it.


Are we talking NSA-level?
Someone that has used years to develop this method?

Thank you for your replies
Click to expand...

Hiding payloads inside a mouse is child's play to a serious electronics enthusiast. There's lots of empty space in most mice, and there's 2.5 to 5 watts of power available from the existing USB cable (the amount of power the mouse needs is like a rounding error compared to that). Not to mention the USB data conection to the computer is already there, just waiting to be exploited.

You can do it with off-the-shelf parts and not even need to design and manufacture new technology. Look at this: USB Mouse With Storage Added That was 14+ years ago and this guy was able to install a USB hub and flash drive inside a mouse. Nowadays stuff is even smaller. You could add a tiny computer with its own cellular data connection, using power from the existing USB cable, all with the resources available to a typical high school kid. The most challenging part would still be adding a camera with a useful image without the lens being terribly obvious to the user. That is the reason you won't find a spy camera in a mouse. There are just way too many easier things you could do with the space and power available.

But honestly this is 2025. Forget about the mouse. Advanced malicious devices can fit in the USB plug at the end of the cable. O.MG Cable Anyone can just buy these things online. Think about that for a minute.

Also, the idea that antivirus software is going to block targeted malware is laughable. Every virus infection you or anyone else's computer ever got, failed to be blocked by antivirus software.
 
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bp2008 said:
Hiding payloads inside a mouse is child's play to a serious electronics enthusiast. There's lots of empty space in most mice, and there's 2.5 to 5 watts of power available from the existing USB cable (the amount of power the mouse needs is like a rounding error compared to that). Not to mention the USB data conection to the computer is already there, just waiting to be exploited.

You can do it with off-the-shelf parts and not even need to design and manufacture new technology. Look at this: USB Mouse With Storage Added That was 14+ years ago and this guy was able to install a USB hub and flash drive inside a mouse. Nowadays stuff is even smaller. You could add a tiny computer with its own cellular data connection, using power from the existing USB cable, all with the resources available to a typical high school kid. The most challenging part would still be adding a camera with a useful image without the lens being terribly obvious to the user. That is the reason you won't find a spy camera in a mouse. There are just way too many easier things you could do with the space and power available.

But honestly this is 2025. Forget about the mouse. Advanced malicious devices can fit in the USB plug at the end of the cable. O.MG Cable Anyone can just buy these things online. Think about that for a minute.

Also, the idea that antivirus software is going to block targeted malware is laughable. Every virus infection you or anyone else's computer ever got, failed to be blocked by antivirus software.
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Excellent advice. Nearly as good as my previous post.
Best advice as stated previously, is to put the mouse in an old stinky sock and still have control. The cam within the mouse will be totally obscured.
 
bp2008 said:
You can do it with off-the-shelf parts and not even need to design and manufacture new technology. Look at this: USB Mouse With Storage Added That was 14+ years ago and this guy was able to install a USB hub and flash drive inside a mouse.
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It was my understanding, that the only data a mouse holds, is the firmware, and that new data can't be added / written to a mouse. (this is a mouse that has not been manipulated with)
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Whats your opinion on this?

Your example of the hidden drive, proves that installing new hardware, can make the mouse contain new data - that could be malware or some malicious code.
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But in the article, the system recognizes the manipulated mouse a new drive.
How would you counter that?
It would require, that you change the firmware of the added hardware / drive?

bp2008 said:
You could add a tiny computer with its own cellular data connection, using power from the existing USB cable, all with the resources available to a typical high school kid. The most challenging part would still be adding a camera with a useful image without the lens being terribly obvious to the user.
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Do you know if this kind of system exist? (I am not looking for a source or link)
And if so, would it be easily obtainable for the average person - or would it need to be build from scratch?

bp2008 said:
Also, the idea that antivirus software is going to block targeted malware is laughable. Every virus infection you or anyone else's computer ever got, failed to be blocked by antivirus software.
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Targeted malware, that MS Defender would not block.
How would someone obtain that?
Buy it on the dark web?

I am looking for good arguments, that these scenarions would not happen to me / target me.

Thank you for your inputs
 
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