Neighbour needs to install a camera at the entrance to his property, 300 yards from his house - which will be his first CCTV system. He has electricity at his gates so what would be the best way to set up a camera so far away?
300 yards
- Thread starter ipOsX
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I would say optical fiber (especially if you have lots of lightning in your area) but there are also range extenders for regular CAT5/6 cable:
www.veracityglobal.com
The above is simply the first hit when I Google 'long range ethernet'. One possible advantage of such an extender is that it might provide PoE such as the one above but since you have electricity there that might not be necessary. Personally though I prefer to run my camera's on PoE even if electrical power is nearby as that way they will continue to function if there's a power failure (PoE switch is connected to UPS). Easier and cheaper than putting a UPS near each camera.
PRODUCTS | Veracity
Veracity products can be divided into four categories - IP Transmission, Video Storage, Video Wall Display Controllers and Integrated Security Management Systems
www.veracityglobal.com
The above is simply the first hit when I Google 'long range ethernet'. One possible advantage of such an extender is that it might provide PoE such as the one above but since you have electricity there that might not be necessary. Personally though I prefer to run my camera's on PoE even if electrical power is nearby as that way they will continue to function if there's a power failure (PoE switch is connected to UPS). Easier and cheaper than putting a UPS near each camera.
Thank you. Those Longspan extenders don't come cheap but if my neighbour only needs one of them (other extenders seem to need inserting at every 100 yards), it wouldn't be too bad. I assume if he were to run a camera off a POE switch then he wouldn't need the POE version of the extender? (The non-POE version is about half the price.) Does it have to go in the middle of the cable or can it be deployed anywhere?
Slight worry about pulling it through 300 yards of duct without a winch!
Slight worry about pulling it through 300 yards of duct without a winch!
I'm not familiar with the product, like I said it was simply the first thing that came up on Google. But it looks like that particular product (they have several others) goes at both ends of the connection, not in the middle. I'm pretty sure you'll need the PoE version of the extender if you want to power the camera that way but best to ask the vendor.
You want to pull it through an existing duct? Perhaps also carrying 230V AC? Perhaps not a very good idea and possibly against code or perhaps not if the AC cables is in fact a single burrial rated multi-pair cable (called YMvKas here in the Netherlands). In that case you should still use shielded CAT cable. But It might be a better idea to use optical fiber if it's going to go through the same duct as the 230V AC for both safety and interference reasons.
If you're going to be laying a new (burried I assume) duct you could simply pull it through section by section. Try to put as much distance between the ducts as possible (at least 3 feet).
No, he's thinking of a dedicated flexible duct for POE - one length for the full 300 yards. And I know how difficult it can be to pull uncooperative cable through just 50 yards of duct.
Indeed. I'm not sure it's something you should try (especially not with flexible duct). Perhaps simply use burrial rated CAT6 cable without any duct. In fact you should use that anyway as I can guarantee that your duct (flexible or not) is going to have water in it. If it's a lot of work to dig the trench you might want to lay two cables (N+1 rule) while you're at it.
Flexible duct makes pulling cable more difficult by the way but for this length I can understand why you'd want to use it. You could still cut it into 50 yard sections and then glue those together. I don't think the strain on the cable while pulling it through 300 yards of flexible duct is going to do it any good, but I have no experience with such lengths.
Flexible duct makes pulling cable more difficult by the way but for this length I can understand why you'd want to use it. You could still cut it into 50 yard sections and then glue those together. I don't think the strain on the cable while pulling it through 300 yards of flexible duct is going to do it any good, but I have no experience with such lengths.
I would have suggested just laying bare burial grade to him but if he needs in-line POE extenders how would he protect them?
The trench comes 'free' as he is having fibre broadband installed.
The trench comes 'free' as he is having fibre broadband installed.
The ones I linked to come at the extreme ends only, not in the middle, and could be kept above ground.
Some wild and wonderful push/pull ideas here. I specially like the idea of using magnets; and am tempted by using a small RC vehicle or a live rat.
Fish tape alternatives for feeding cable through duct
Fish tape alternatives for feeding cable through duct
If there is a fairly clear line-of-sight from the gate back to the house Unifi makes some inexpensive point-to-point bridges that folks here have used. The names are escaping me right now but I think they’re called Loco or Nano stations and I’ve seen a few threads here from folks using them.
Also, Dahua’s cameras that support ePoE can use a super-long coax cable for long runs. Needs adapters and an ePoE network switch, but didn’t sound overly expensive.
Also, Dahua’s cameras that support ePoE can use a super-long coax cable for long runs. Needs adapters and an ePoE network switch, but didn’t sound overly expensive.
Thanks: I've had a quick look at Unifi and suspect that most of their kit would take him over budget. Maybe overkill too since they claim a range of 15-25km. I'll look at the ePOE options.
Two of their Loco M5 should be around $150 total, which I’d think would be cheaper than cable. There are a few threads on the forum here from folks using them if you wanted to see the types of situations they’ve been used for.
Broachoski
Getting comfortable
I agree with aristobrat as I have 2 Loco M5 units spaced about 300 yards apart and they work very well and at that close of a distance will work thru some obstacles.
Having reviewed my neighbour's topography, he doesn't have line of sight to his gates as the main house sits in a dip; so I'm leaning towards a wired solution. Dahua's ePOE system makes most appeal because:
- we understand POE so can install this ourselves, without calling in specialists;
- a single length of burial grade cable that doesn't require extenders or converters (or duct - although we may opt for duct);
- it may work out as the cheapest solution.
It does seem like overkill to have to buy a 16ch ePOE switch and an ePOE NVR for a single cam but maybe he will want to expand the system in the future - and I assume the ePOE system is compatible with POE and could even be used as a passive ethernet hub if he needs to plug other devices in.
If it happens, I'll report back. Thanks for all suggestions.
- we understand POE so can install this ourselves, without calling in specialists;
- a single length of burial grade cable that doesn't require extenders or converters (or duct - although we may opt for duct);
- it may work out as the cheapest solution.
It does seem like overkill to have to buy a 16ch ePOE switch and an ePOE NVR for a single cam but maybe he will want to expand the system in the future - and I assume the ePOE system is compatible with POE and could even be used as a passive ethernet hub if he needs to plug other devices in.
If it happens, I'll report back. Thanks for all suggestions.
CCTVCam
Known around here
- Sep 25, 2017
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Just a thought here - why not put the cable through the conduit BEFORE you bury it? Saves a lot of hassle if you bury the conduit with the cable already inside!
Also, another thought, at the same time feed a length of rot proof thin para-cord through the conduit as well leaving plenty at both ends which can be tied off somewhere safe. Then if you ever need to feed a replacement POE cable through it once it's buried, you have 2 chances - you can attach the replacement POE to the end of the existing POE and use that to pull it through or if it fails or snaps part way through, you pull the replacement back out then fasten it and a new piece of para-cord to the end of the existing para-cord and use that to pull the new stuff through (you need to new para-cord to replace the old you're pulling out with the cable). When they're through you discard the old para-cord, tie the new off as before and connect the new POE cable. That then leaves you ready to go for next time.
That is the plan. It's still likely to be problematic pulling the cable through 300 yards of flexible duct (or even rigid duct) so we'll probably have to saw it up and glue it back together afterwards (the duct, not the cable!). The duct comes with a string draw cord already in place but I reckon it's likely to snap under the weight of 300 yards of burial grade ePOE cable so I'll probably pull through a stronger cord. Maybe Tupperware could come up with an airtight snap-together two-piece duct…
Using cable glide lubricant might also help but I would definitely not try pulling through 300 yards at once, cutting up and glueing together is what I would do. And yes it's (obviously I would almost say) best to pull cable before burying. Using wider tubing/duct also helps. And although it doesn't make things easier or cheaper, consider pulling two cables instead of one.
And yes, definitely use the draw cord to pull through a proper pull cord first. And you probably know this but make sure you pull and push the cable through at the same time.
And yes, definitely use the draw cord to pull through a proper pull cord first. And you probably know this but make sure you pull and push the cable through at the same time.
I pulled 3 separate Cat6 cables through a 40 metre flexible duct (40mm internal diameter) in my garden last week and got them through with a garden twine draw cord. I taped the cables together first with duct tape every 2 metres and although obviously heavier than a single cable, they were less inclined to buckle or kink so might even have made the job easier. I did have to pull hard though towards the end.