New set up questions.

[MrRalphMan]

Hi All,

I've been looking at getting an CCTV system and have been window shopping for a while, trying to decide on the equipment to get.

The choice so far is as follows.

NVR:
Hikvision DS-7608 NI-E2/8P

Thinking of getting this from Amazon with 2GB drive for now:

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Hikvision-...&qid=1471511171&sr=8-1&keywords=hikvision+nvr

Main Cameras:
4 MP Hikvision turrets

But I have the following questions.

1) - Can I use Chinese Turrets from AE with this English NVR?* I know the issues on upgrading Firmware, but as long as they work they can stay with what they come with.

2) - Either local or from AE, what Turrets are recommended?* I need a few to cover the outside of the building.* It's quite well lit for part of the night with close road lights, but totally dark for some of it.

3) - On a side note, we've had dog training issues and we've been recommended to have a couple of cameras in the house to see what she does when we're out.** These probably won't be a perminent fixture, but if she's funny then they might stay.*

So some advice on which ones would be good.* These might be connected directly to a powerlie plug for now or at worse case a seperate WiFi Network solely for the NVR.

This will be the first CCTV system that I've set up, but I'm fairly technical, so I'm hoping that once I get going it's going to be fun.

Thanks,

Paul





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[MrRalphMan]

Hi all,

Sorry to bump, just wanted to see if any one can help.

Paul

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[PSPCommOp]

Can't say I have any advise with that NVR, sorry.

The HikVis turrets are good, but if you wanna put one or two inside, try the Hik Cubes. Will prob save you some money AND you can use an SD card and two way audio. Turrets don't offer either feature.

Final piece of advise, stay away from the 2.8mm turrets, they provide horrible quality compared to 4mm/6mm.

 

[NVR]

I have the 4mp Turrets, great cameras in the day time but useless at night. My plan is to downgrade to 2mp's (much better night shots) until a solid and cost effective solution for nighttime is available for the higher mp's.

 

[Del Boy]

1) Don't buy from Amazon
2) Don't cheap-ass it getting xxx5 cameras you can't update later

I use to say get AE cameras but the price difference isn't big enough to justify that anymore. You're better off local and getting warranty support and UK/International versions.

2MP Hikvision isn't that great compared to 2MP Dahua Sony Exmor ones. I wouldn't downgrade 4MP WD cameras for 2MP WD cameras. Not sure about xxx5 ones at night. I do have one but it's sat in it's box at the moment!

If you need a response from someone in the UK use the @Del Boy or reply with a quote so I see it. Often I don't see it.

 

[NVR]

I hate the downgrading myself, but seeing the night performance difference leaves no choice if nighttime performance is of significance. The nighttime gain with the 2mp is worth the small daytime loss in quality.

Until today all the low light performers provided by Hik such as the darkfighter and lightfighter are still at 2mp.

http://overseas.hikvision.com/en/products_506.html

Will check out that 2mp Dahua myself.

 

[nayr]

just add some more IR..

cheap ass standard camera + high powered IR spotlight > darkfighter/starlight for less than half as much.

for the OP I am weary about Hikvision and mixing grey market.. either go with US Market or go w/Dahua

 

[NVR]

I just took this shot, there are 3 cameras aiming in this direction, one Huisun with its powerful array crossing the street, and 2 4mp's aiming in the same area, one slightly to the right. A street lamp is on and another front-yard light directly in front of the subject.

Still images may appear ok but once there's the slightest of motion the image is as you see ( look at the feet) . I wouldnt mind adding more IR on a camera that has an already descent night performance but not this model.

 

[nayr]

yesh that is pretty damn poor, here is me in full motion on my 4MP Dahua LXIR.. not the greatest, but not too bad once you realize that I am standing in damn near total darkness w/out any other lighting than what the camera has.. if I put an IR spotlight in this dark corner it'd be lit up like those branches from my ALPR spotlight and be basically noiseless with several times better shutter speed than its at now.

you got some detail there tho with that Huisun spotlight.. you need more IR, I think 4MP w/out LXIR is really underwhelming but it can be fixed w/external IR.. if its too dark, the solution is to add more light.. pretty simple.

Street lights are shit for cameras, if I turn the IR off on my 2MP PTZ and try to get an image of something directly under a lamp its absolutely horrible.. hardly makes any difference IMHO.. The 2MP Huisun has some powerful IR on it to give you the impression its night performance is better than you think it is.. as is required with high zoom.

 

[NVR]

You should see moving cars, looks like a space show. This is why Im going with 2mp on any new installations until we find a good night performer for cheap.

Your Dahua also looks like its lacking a bit, feet are distorted.

Now lets compare with a 2mp cheap huisun using an IMX sensor

This was from an old thread, close up via cropping but they beat these 4mps.

.


Ok found the clip, aside from the actual cameras durability, the image is above acceptable.

 

[nayr]

the cheap Huisun has 4 high powered LXIR LED's on it.. your Hik Turret has what, one? How much power does that Huisun take at idle with IR on? from what I seen something like ~10W minimum, mine is using 4W of power.. the additional IR accounts the difference.

apples and oranges man.. My LPR spotlight is 13W and adjustable beam, before I put it in the birdhouse I slapped it up on the side over here and the image was every bit as good as my 2MP 1/2.8 IMX PTZ that runs 24W w/IR on.

Move your Huisun PTZ to give this area light and repeat this test, I bet it'll be alot better than you give it credit for.

 

[NVR]

Totally get that, but the still image I posted above had plenty of lighting, even using the Huisuns IR and more.

My point is not fall for the higher MP chase without seeing night samples with motion.

If I had to do it now, I would get the 32ch 12mp Dauhua NVR you (Nayr) mention in other threads, with some good 2mps. The NVR which is very reasonably priced, would future proof in the event something better arises for nighttime imaging.

 

[nayr]

I understand the desire to hold onto the 2MP 1/2.8 IMX's they are fantastic and cheap.. my 4MP LPR camera does fantastic at night, but its got adequate lighting.. here's some high moving targets @ 1/500 shutter through a 4MP Dahua.

Just trying to point out that it is possible to have both, and I see no point in investing in starlight/darkfighter cameras unless you simply cannot add any additional lighting.. like actually looking at stars/weather/scenery.

UHD 4k is actually bringing us larger size optics, which will result in better offerings for very low light HD cameras like the Longse.. right now the killer is all CCTV lenses not 1/3rd format or compatible are expensive and not mass produced for cheap like these have been for a decade now..

 

[NVR]

I think part of the problem is that companies are forced to create higher MP cameras to stay alive in the market yet are tied with smaller size sensors for cost reasons. The outcome is a performer like the 4mp Hik $90 shipped. So glad I did not pay the $160 they were going for, for the US model.

The new 5mp Hik using 1/1.8" sensor might perform well, not sure anyone here has purchased one ( aside from the longse) and they were $600 each which would eliminate it for me as an option. Hopefully they do come down in price.

Lower pic is the 4mp Hik with the Huisun aiming in the same direction above. Speed of about 20-25MPH

Image is of the same car. Lower pic getting the same IR from the Huisun and a street lamp.

.

 

[nayr]

thats to be expected, at night all cars will be blury with autoexposure.. here I am @ 75ft at a full stride.. litup by my LPR light.. you cant see my feet, because its very narrow IR beam

obviously I am overexposed, but if I added more light to the whole scene that would not be a problem.. as auto exposure would be running a higher shutter speed w/less noise and blur.

 

[PSPCommOp]

I have the 4mp Turrets, great cameras in the day time but useless at night. My plan is to downgrade to 2mp's (much better night shots) until a solid and cost effective solution for nighttime is available for the higher mp's.

What model are you looking at?

 

[NVR]

This thread discusses this topic extensively.

https://www.ipcamtalk.com/showthread.php/5102-2MP-vs-4MP

 

[MrRalphMan]

just add some more IR..

cheap ass standard camera + high powered IR spotlight > darkfighter/starlight for less than half as much.

for the OP I am weary about Hikvision and mixing grey market.. either go with US Market or go w/Dahua

Thanks dude, I'm actually in the UK, but the price difference isn't as much as I thought, so will probably go with UK cameras from Amazon. At least if they are not working I'll have some come back.

Is there a Dahua setup that comes in around the same budget that you'd recommend?

 

[car_wash_guy]

I understand the desire to hold onto the 2MP 1/2.8 IMX's they are fantastic and cheap.. my 4MP LPR camera does fantastic at night, but its got adequate lighting.. here's some high moving targets @ 1/500 shutter through a 4MP Dahua.

Just trying to point out that it is possible to have both, and I see no point in investing in starlight/darkfighter cameras unless you simply cannot add any additional lighting.. like actually looking at stars/weather/scenery.

UHD 4k is actually bringing us larger size optics, which will result in better offerings for very low light HD cameras like the Longse.. right now the killer is all CCTV lenses not 1/3rd format or compatible are expensive and not mass produced for cheap like these have been for a decade now..

Hey nayr-

I triend to send you a IM but apparently was unable. I seen in many posts you're a proponent of Dahua. I'm on the other side of CO and am setting up a 16 camera system for a commercial location, and am considering Dahua.

I need the ability to pic plates day and night, and your posted pics are what I'm looking for.

What camera, and do you leave the settings like that all the time, or is it possible to set up a time schedule to chance the settings for day/night?

Also, did you purchase the stuff from AE? If so, which seller?

 

[nayr]

@car_wash_guy, capturing license plates at night requires that the cameras be dedicated to that task.. having the exposures setup correctly leaves the image pitch black anytime there is nothing highly reflective in frame.

it also requires re-focusing at night, I have an external automation program that changes all the settings for me.