IP camera system for a house in the woods

MrMeeseeks

MrMeeseeks

n3wb
Feb 9, 2019
15
0
Bothell, WA
A week ago someone stole a pressure washer, mower, blower and plate compactor from my tractor shed. I freaked out and bought some Ring doorbells and cameras. For all the reasons you folks are aware, I'm not very happy with the system (Although the cloud recording and 2-way mic/speaker are awesome). So right now I'm in the middle of setting up a Ubiquiti network and am fishing Cat6 through my walls.

I was all set to buy a 4 dome 4K set from Lorex until I found this place and read through the Cliff Notes a few times. I've gone through the IPVM tool, done my layouts, and would love if you guys could share some experience with me to help avoid unnecessary costs and pitfalls.

First up, I have a 600'+ driveway. There is only one way in and out. I'm protected by trees and a valley otherwise. The builder installed power for street lamps, but never finished the project. I'm confident that I can get 10 amps of power down there. In orange, I've shown were the lamp posts are, and where I'd have access to AC. My current plan is to install a Ubiquiti NanoBridge between the house road and PoEi all the cameras at the gate I need to install.

M1IHWPy.jpg


Being that there is only one way in, I'm thinking of mounting a really nice 8MP or 12MP camera overlooking my driveway. I have a Ring Stick Up mounted there now. I've annotated the distances, and at 105' you can see the shed that was taken from. One option would be a dedicated LPR at the top of the driveway.

B4TRbxH.jpg


If I have a LPR at the gate, and one where I've shown in red, I might not need a 12MP. But it might good for evidence.

At the gate I'm thinking 3 cameras. One LPR, a PTZ, and a camera mounted in the woods to protect it all.
c2lqppM.png


If you made it this far, thank you! Here are few of the things going in my head:
  1. Based on above, is there a 8MP or 12MP that stands out as a good camera for my situation?
  2. I don't really have a huge need for Starlights. Other than the driveway cameras, the others would mostly be used for general surveillance and checking out wildlife at night (we have coyotes, bears, etc). I'm still trading level of detail during the day vs awesome night time performance. Is there a camera that is a good midpoint between level of detail and night performance that's around $200?
  3. I'm assuming that BI and a dedicated PC is the NVR of choice around here, so I was planning on getting started with that.
  4. I really like the two-way talk on the Ring cameras. Is there a way to duplicate that with the Dahua?
Again, thank you for any direction you might offer!
 
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Let me be clear I have not used the NanoBridge so not speaking from direct experience or authority, but my first thought was "Will that work at 500ft through all those trees?".

Laying a fiber cable would be a consideration if there ends up being a real concern about a wireless link through the woods.
 
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Hi!

Great cabin and great location.

Some comments & suggestions based on your layouts:
- higher MP does not render in "better" pictures, especially during "evening/night" time. As read in the Cliff Notes, the higher the MP, the worser night vision. So together with positioning your cams, do take into account some wiring for (additional) IR lightning. The more light, the better the images.
- you draw some serious wide angle FOVs. Keep in mind: the wider the angle, the worser the DORI distances. They are GREAT in spotting "something" moving around (Detect) however they need to put their nose under the cam unless you can identify (I) the thug.
- that's why my moto is: more the merrier (especially your North & NorthWest corners) are uncovered spaces. If you would have some windows /doors facing that side, you are blind there.
- from the right hand side at your driveway: you're blind too?
- ubiquity seems to have some cutting edge beam force technologies, but you might opt for to a 30 days trial or money back guarantee, especially with the trees, or you put beams in between your power poles, but that makes them vulnerable too: if the beam gets "blocked" you loose your entrance vids
- Dahua does have some VTO bi-directional devices, I have a couple of VTO2000A (together with an indoor station called VTH1550CH), but it works perfectly on mobile device too. This device is EOL, but there is a successor somewhere with the same capabilities.

Hope this helps!
CC
 
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I would hard wire as much as you can. Ubiquity is a good brand.. I use Engenius for similar what you are doing... but poking holes through trees is pretty hard to do. In the fall when leaves are down it works fine.. but soon as the leaves are back on, it is not happening. If you can get above the trees and get a straight shot, I'd be surprise if it works. Just a side note, maybe a game camera/field cam with cell service that can send pictures from that location. Running three cams on one Ubiquity my be pushing the bandwidth of it as well... running 10 FPS on all three or less without dropping out might work.

Whatever you end up doing will be interested to hear how you end up.
 
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+1^^^.
I'm BIG fan of UBNT (used Engenius up until 2010) but all radios have issues with trees, poor LOS. Even down to the "less-affected-by-foliage" 900 MHz....it also likely won't be able to punch through either when the leaves return.

Not sure if PLA (power line adapter) would work at that distance either.

Fiber may be an option...expensive and labor intensive but no doubt it could provide the bandwidth, noise immunity and isolation form ESD / lightning. EDIT 0735 CT: Must be in PVC conduit to help keep the tree roots from ruining it after a time.
 
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You have a very dense forest to shoot through for a Ubiquiti NanoBridge. Not to mention when it snows or rains, the signal attenuation will get worse. Very doubtful you could get a decent signal for the required bandwidth. You would probably have to setup a multiple repeater system and shoot down a line of sight of the drive. That would entail a lot more equipment and maintenance over time, and a lot of headaches. Probably best bet is to use enet cable w/ extenders. You could always lay the outside rated cable on ground and cover w/ the pine needles, if it is in areas where nothing disturbs it. Place a Poe switch at end of drive, powered by your existing AC power, in a environmental enclosure. Go w/ the Dahua Starlight cams.
 
@MrMeeseeks ,

With an average of only 9 thunderstorms with severe lighting each year, your area (WA state) is certainly no "lightning mecca of the world" as is FL, but should you go to the less expensive route of 500 feet metallic conductor on top off or in the ground, I'd install extensive ESD and surge protection as best I could and prepare for a worst case scenario, even with a nearby (not direct) lightning strike.

It only takes one severe equipment loss by such an event to negate the money you saved by not going the safest, albeit the most expensive, route of fiber.

I understand it's easy for me to say this, as it's not my money.... and of course, it's your choice.....just my 2 cents worth.

Best of luck and progress with your project.
 
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TonyR said:
...

Fiber may be an option...expensive and labor intensive but no doubt it could provide the bandwidth, noise immunity and isolation form ESD / lightning. EDIT 0735 CT: Must be in PVC conduit to help keep the tree roots from ruining it after a time.
Click to expand...

I've been looking at some armored direct burial fiber cables from LAN Shack et al. Conduit probably is always best, but with the armored cable do you opine conduit is still a must?

Thin Armored Fiber Optic Assembly | Outdoor Direct Bury Fiber Assembly | Micro Armor Fiber
 
Whoaru99 said:
I've been looking at some armored direct burial fiber cables from LAN Shack et al. Conduit probably is always best, but with the armored cable do you opine conduit is still a must?

Thin Armored Fiber Optic Assembly | Outdoor Direct Bury Fiber Assembly | Micro Armor Fiber
Click to expand...

Great idea and would likely afford the protection that conduit would regarding rodents, not sure about advantages above ground. That armor adds some cost, too. If installed, I'd stop that stainless steel jacket a few feet (10? I don't know) from both ends to discourage the ESD / lightning from using it as a highway, negating the advantage that an non-metallic, all fiber-optic transmission media provides.
 
I have not found all the detail but it sounds like (at least some) outdoor cables can only be run a limited distance indoors because of the gel/water block being a problem in case of fire. My plan would be to have a junction box upon entry then use indoor-rated/plenum-rated fiber patch as necessary to the other switch, computer, etc. Might be some sort of bonding/grounding/Earthing requirement for the armor too but have not found that yet.
 
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What is the need to put all the cameras down at the end of the driveway?

Instead could you do something like a camera on each light pole, with backhaul to the house, to get lots of shots of any vehicle/people otw up and down your driveway? And then use the extra cameras to cover the exterior of the house in every direction better for wildlife or anything coming out of the woods? Just feels like it would reduce some of the complexity.
 
Whoaru99 said:
. My plan would be to have a junction box upon entry then use indoor-rated/plenum-rated fiber patch as necessary to the other switch, computer, etc.
Click to expand...
Agreed.
I use Ubiquiti ToughCable Pro, which is shielded, and stop it outdoors before entry into house, plugged into one their surge arrestors, grounded. I don't run the shielded into the house.
 
MrMeeseeks said:
I was all set to buy a 4 dome 4K set from Lorex until I found this place and read through the Cliff Notes a few times. I've gone through the IPVM tool, done my layouts, and would love if you guys could share some experience with me to help avoid unnecessary costs and pitfalls.

First up, I have a 600'+ driveway. There is only one way in and out. I'm protected by trees and a valley otherwise. The builder installed power for street lamps, but never finished the project. I'm confident that I can get 10 amps of power down there. In orange, I've shown were the lamp posts are, and where I'd have access to AC. My current plan is to install a Ubiquiti NanoBridge between the house road and PoEi all the cameras at the gate I need to install.

M1IHWPy.jpg


Being that there is only one way in, I'm thinking of mounting a really nice 8MP or 12MP camera overlooking my driveway. I have a Ring Stick Up mounted there now. I've annotated the distances, and at 105' you can see the shed that was taken from. One option would be a dedicated LPR at the top of the driveway.
Click to expand...
Those are some pretty wide fields of view on those cameras in your image. Don't expect much at those distances. Generally expecting more than an 80-90 degree field of view out of a camera is trouble. The image will be distorted and typically you won't have very useful level of detail if you get more than 5-10 feet away from the camera. Realistically you'll need more than 4 cameras at the house, in some areas you'll probably even want overlapping coverage. Varifocal cameras a a good option, you can zoom in/out to get the FOV just right.

Someone could wander onto and off of your property through the woods or even from a neighbor's driveway. Monitoring your driveway is a good idea, you may even want to control access by adding a gate and intercom. This is an expensive option.
 
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Just did my 1st install using just 2 $99 Ubiquity outdoor APs https://amzn.to/2StmV6e

Plug and play. Its been a month and they are working 100% 500ft from each other.

Not sure how the trees effect APs, but you could add one at each power outlet if needed...


Ive switched to using just Dahua 25x for pier MY SETUP and they work great when your not sure about FOV with awesome night vision.

Another 25x on my barn watching my gate 150ft away only at 4x and another at complete darkness except for the road light 200 yards away
1551151887671.jpg 1551151170771.jpg

25x view at 1x

1551151817842.jpg
 
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I think I'd paint or dark tape over the backside of that sign with the high reflective surface, might help your exposure at night.
 
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