How long til it all makes sense??

[Larry Smith]

First of all I must thank everyone for all the reviews, info, and help that is given to all members here. It is really awesome so many people contribute so much time and effort to help out.

I am currently trying to navigate what seems to be an endless expanse known as home surveillance. I am trying to read all the new member sticky’s and guides but it feels the more I read the harder it is to sort out. I’m sure this is a sentiment most of the long tenured members have heard before but I guess I just needed to get it off my chest. Thanks again and I’m sure I’ll ask some dumb questions haha

 

[IAmATeaf]

Hi there and welcome.

In terms of progressing, you need to decide on NVR versus Blue Iris and then start choosing the cams. The more you read the more confusing it might get in terms of info overload.

I decided to go the BI route so got a POE switch, then a few Starlight 2Mp cams and then a PC to run BI on. Once you have that you can then start playing around, which I’m still doing

 

[gwminor48]

Hello, welcome to the forum. It can be a bit overwhelming but you'll get there.

 

[TonyR]

+1 to what @IAmATeaf said.

Blue Iris on a dedicated PC that conforms to this spec and is optimized for Blue Iris would be my suggestion for someone who is starting out and struggling with the task and feels overwhelmed.

Start out with a few cams that provide the best all-around results:

• Use turret style for best results (bullets have issues with spider webs, domes can have issues with glare and IR bounce backs as dome can get fogged by moisture and dust)
• For best low-light performance, choose 2MP Dahua Starlight, Hikvision Dark Fighter or IPCT Night Eye; don't get wrapped up by more megapixels, the hi-resolution cams generally want more light.
• Choose a vari-focal cam so you won't have to be concerned about a 2.8mm being too far away/too wide or a 4mm being too close/too narrow for your various (and different) locations.
• Mount at 7 feet optimally / 8 feet max.
• Use POE cams with POE switch (wired, Ethernet cable provides power and data), avoid wireless.
• Use solid (not stranded) copper (not CCA "Copper Clad Aluminum) CAT-5e or 6 cable with jacket rated for your application (CMR for indoors, direct/flooded burial for outdoors due to UV, ozone and moisture)
• If you only see using 4 cams now, buy a 8 port POE switch, as you'll want MORE cams later!
• Put that PC and the POE switch(es) on a quality 1,000VA UPS (battery backup); I prefer APC or Tripplite

For all-around performance and usage, it's hard to beat the Dahua IPC-HDW5231R-ZEfrom @EMPIRETECANDY of Empire Technology. It's a turret, POE, 2MP Starlight and has a vari-focal lens.

@SouthernYankee has a check list for newbs, he'll likely post it soon and it's a good one. Welcome to IPCT!

 

[bigredfish]

How long til it all makes sense??

About $2000 long...

 

[TL1096r]

First of all I must thank everyone for all the reviews, info, and help that is given to all members here. It is really awesome so many people contribute so much time and effort to help out.

I am currently trying to navigate what seems to be an endless expanse known as home surveillance. I am trying to read all the new member sticky’s and guides but it feels the more I read the harder it is to sort out. I’m sure this is a sentiment most of the long tenured members have heard before but I guess I just needed to get it off my chest. Thanks again and I’m sure I’ll ask some dumb questions haha

yes, and can get expensive but worth the effort. I made a step by step guide if you want to go with the blue iris route:
Newbie Starter Guide to IP Cam System – VPN setup – Computer Hardware – Blue Iris – Dahua Cameras

I try to add to it daily based on new useful info I find on the forum.

start and then ask what you get stuck on and people can better help with more specific questions.

 

[windguy]

@Larry Smith - Welcome to the forum. I'm a newbie as well and I can empathize with what you're going through. The problem is that it gets very time consuming to sort through all the threads and wikis in a quest to learn more about this technology. I used to look at porn at night but now I just scour this forum trying to absorb as much as possible. Only kidding about the porn part, maybe. No harm in sharing some of your thoughts in what you want to accomplish with your home security system and parameters you're working within.

 

[Larry Smith]

+1 to what @IAmATeaf said.

Blue Iris on a dedicated PC that conforms to this spec and is optimized for Blue Iris would be my suggestion for someone who is starting out and struggling with the task and feels overwhelmed.

Start out with a few cams that provide the best all-around results:

• Use turret style for best results (bullets have issues with spider webs, domes can have issues with glare and IR bounce backs as dome can get fogged by moisture and dust)
• For best low-light performance, choose 2MP Dahua Starlight, Hikvision Dark Fighter or IPCT Night Eye; don't get wrapped up by more megapixels, the hi-resolution cams generally want more light.
• Choose a vari-focal cam so you won't have to be concerned about a 2.8mm being too far away/too wide or a 4mm being too close/too narrow for your various (and different) locations.
• Mount at 7 feet optimally / 8 feet max.
• Use POE cams with POE switch (wired, Ethernet cable provides power and data), avoid wireless.
• Use solid (not stranded) copper (not CCA "Copper Clad Aluminum) CAT-5e or 6 cable with jacket rated for your application (CMR for indoors, direct/flooded burial for outdoors due to UV, ozone and moisture)
• If you only see using 4 cams now, buy a 8 port POE switch, as you'll want MORE cams later!
• Put that PC and the POE switch(es) on a quality 1,000VA UPS (battery backup); I prefer APC or Tripplite

For all-around performance and usage, it's hard to beat the Dahua IPC-HDW5231R-ZEfrom @EMPIRETECANDY of Empire Technology. It's a turret, POE, 2MP Starlight and has a vari-focal lens.

@SouthernYankee has a check list for newbs, he'll likely post it soon and it's a good one. Welcome to IPCT!

+1 to what @IAmATeaf said.

Blue Iris on a dedicated PC that conforms to this spec and is optimized for Blue Iris would be my suggestion for someone who is starting out and struggling with the task and feels overwhelmed.

Start out with a few cams that provide the best all-around results:

• Use turret style for best results (bullets have issues with spider webs, domes can have issues with glare and IR bounce backs as dome can get fogged by moisture and dust)
• For best low-light performance, choose 2MP Dahua Starlight, Hikvision Dark Fighter or IPCT Night Eye; don't get wrapped up by more megapixels, the hi-resolution cams generally want more light.
• Choose a vari-focal cam so you won't have to be concerned about a 2.8mm being too far away/too wide or a 4mm being too close/too narrow for your various (and different) locations.
• Mount at 7 feet optimally / 8 feet max.
• Use POE cams with POE switch (wired, Ethernet cable provides power and data), avoid wireless.
• Use solid (not stranded) copper (not CCA "Copper Clad Aluminum) CAT-5e or 6 cable with jacket rated for your application (CMR for indoors, direct/flooded burial for outdoors due to UV, ozone and moisture)
• If you only see using 4 cams now, buy a 8 port POE switch, as you'll want MORE cams later!
• Put that PC and the POE switch(es) on a quality 1,000VA UPS (battery backup); I prefer APC or Tripplite

For all-around performance and usage, it's hard to beat the Dahua IPC-HDW5231R-ZEfrom @EMPIRETECANDY of Empire Technology. It's a turret, POE, 2MP Starlight and has a vari-focal lens.

@SouthernYankee has a check list for newbs, he'll likely post it soon and it's a good one. Welcome to IPCT!

TonyR-

Thanks for the reply. I think I was leaning toward going the BI route and actually basically everything you outlined as well. I guess what is scaring me is all the info relating to networks and setting all that up correctly to avoid being hacked or isolating the cams from the internet. I did go through the guide that you linked as well. I had actually been learning from a few subs on reddit and someone mentioned this forum and also empiretechandy. I am not super computer savvy so again if I’m honest it’s that part of things that’s giving me the most grief because I’m afraid I’ll jacked up something doing all the BI, can setup, VPN, and other related things. It’s also tough because on a lot of the threads and reply’s there’s a lot of comments and acronyms that I have to google. Thanks for just listing the items and points I need to look at.

 

[Larry Smith]

+1 to what @IAmATeaf said.

Blue Iris on a dedicated PC that conforms to this spec and is optimized for Blue Iris would be my suggestion for someone who is starting out and struggling with the task and feels overwhelmed.

Start out with a few cams that provide the best all-around results:

• Use turret style for best results (bullets have issues with spider webs, domes can have issues with glare and IR bounce backs as dome can get fogged by moisture and dust)
• For best low-light performance, choose 2MP Dahua Starlight, Hikvision Dark Fighter or IPCT Night Eye; don't get wrapped up by more megapixels, the hi-resolution cams generally want more light.
• Choose a vari-focal cam so you won't have to be concerned about a 2.8mm being too far away/too wide or a 4mm being too close/too narrow for your various (and different) locations.
• Mount at 7 feet optimally / 8 feet max.
• Use POE cams with POE switch (wired, Ethernet cable provides power and data), avoid wireless.
• Use solid (not stranded) copper (not CCA "Copper Clad Aluminum) CAT-5e or 6 cable with jacket rated for your application (CMR for indoors, direct/flooded burial for outdoors due to UV, ozone and moisture)
• If you only see using 4 cams now, buy a 8 port POE switch, as you'll want MORE cams later!
• Put that PC and the POE switch(es) on a quality 1,000VA UPS (battery backup); I prefer APC or Tripplite

For all-around performance and usage, it's hard to beat the Dahua IPC-HDW5231R-ZEfrom @EMPIRETECANDY of Empire Technology. It's a turret, POE, 2MP Starlight and has a vari-focal lens.

@SouthernYankee has a check list for newbs, he'll likely post it soon and it's a good one. Welcome to IPCT!

+1 to what @IAmATeaf said.

Blue Iris on a dedicated PC that conforms to this spec and is optimized for Blue Iris would be my suggestion for someone who is starting out and struggling with the task and feels overwhelmed.

Start out with a few cams that provide the best all-around results:

• Use turret style for best results (bullets have issues with spider webs, domes can have issues with glare and IR bounce backs as dome can get fogged by moisture and dust)
• For best low-light performance, choose 2MP Dahua Starlight, Hikvision Dark Fighter or IPCT Night Eye; don't get wrapped up by more megapixels, the hi-resolution cams generally want more light.
• Choose a vari-focal cam so you won't have to be concerned about a 2.8mm being too far away/too wide or a 4mm being too close/too narrow for your various (and different) locations.
• Mount at 7 feet optimally / 8 feet max.
• Use POE cams with POE switch (wired, Ethernet cable provides power and data), avoid wireless.
• Use solid (not stranded) copper (not CCA "Copper Clad Aluminum) CAT-5e or 6 cable with jacket rated for your application (CMR for indoors, direct/flooded burial for outdoors due to UV, ozone and moisture)
• If you only see using 4 cams now, buy a 8 port POE switch, as you'll want MORE cams later!
• Put that PC and the POE switch(es) on a quality 1,000VA UPS (battery backup); I prefer APC or Tripplite

For all-around performance and usage, it's hard to beat the Dahua IPC-HDW5231R-ZEfrom @EMPIRETECANDY of Empire Technology. It's a turret, POE, 2MP Starlight and has a vari-focal lens.

@SouthernYankee has a check list for newbs, he'll likely post it soon and it's a good one. Welcome to IPCT!

TonyR-

Thanks for the reply. I think I was leaning toward going the BI route and actually basically everything you outlined as well. I guess what is scaring me is all the info relating to networks and setting all that up correctly to avoid being hacked or isolating the cams from the internet. I did go through the guide that you linked as well. I had actually been learning from a few subs on reddit and someone mentioned this forum and also empiretechandy. I am not super computer savvy so again if I’m honest it’s that part of things that’s giving me the most grief because I’m afraid I’ll jacked up something doing all the BI, can setup, VPN, and other related things. It’s also tough because on a lot of the threads and reply’s there’s a lot of comments and acronyms that I have to google. Thanks for just listing the items and points I need to look at.

 

[Larry Smith]

@Larry Smith - Welcome to the forum. I'm a newbie as well and I can empathize with what you're going through. The problem is that it gets very time consuming to sort through all the threads and wikis in a quest to learn more about this technology. I used to look at porn at night but now I just scour this forum trying to absorb as much as possible. Only kidding about the porn part, maybe. No harm in sharing some of your thoughts in what you want to accomplish with your home security system and parameters you're working within.

Good points and really what put this into high gear was about a week ago my wife had her car battery stolen from her car. We live in a very small town and shit like this happens but not a lot and typically it’s people that have left their garage door up all night will stuff stolen. I’m not so much worried about forced entry and honestly a camera won’t help me during something like that anyhow. I also have some rental property and the more of them I get I guess feel like people will either think I have money or possibly have pissed tenants that’ll mess with my shit at some point.

So right now I’m thinking min. 2 cams facing the road and possible one on the front porch running to 8 port switch. We park in front on the house which is where the car was when the battery was stolen. I’d guess it’s 40-50’ from the house to the road I can legit measurements if it’s the critical. I was going to go with the cam from Dahua that was mentioned in one of the comments on my post already. One thing that I am really curious about is facial recognition stuff because my thought was had the cameras caught someone in the the act then later on if the same person walked by would it match the persons face to a previous recording? I know this would be provided that the cam got them stealing my battery anyhow. But also are most cameras capable of recognition? Or is that simply a software that can be added to make any cam able to do it? Or had the person been in a vehicle I thought I had already read that some have cams that are simply dedicated to LPR and then again is that another software that is needed and further I recall people using a bullet for that?

So that’s kind of where I’m at and I hope that’s what you meant with what parameters I was going with.

Thanks

 

[TonyR]

TonyR-

Thanks for the reply. I think I was leaning toward going the BI route and actually basically everything you outlined as well. I guess what is scaring me is all the info relating to networks and setting all that up correctly to avoid being hacked or isolating the cams from the internet. I did go through the guide that you linked as well. I had actually been learning from a few subs on reddit and someone mentioned this forum and also empiretechandy. I am not super computer savvy so again if I’m honest it’s that part of things that’s giving me the most grief because I’m afraid I’ll jacked up something doing all the BI, can setup, VPN, and other related things. It’s also tough because on a lot of the threads and reply’s there’s a lot of comments and acronyms that I have to google. Thanks for just listing the items and points I need to look at.

It's a lot to absorb and to many a daunting task, but....

FWIW, you don't have to worry about getting hacked if you don't connect the network to the Internet! You won't be able to access your cameras from a location outside your home but that ability can be added later. You can initially set up a simple network consisting of the BI server, a POE switch and your IP cameras. If you assign to the server and the cameras their own unique, static IP you won't even need a router. A simple example is shown below.

Later, when you're ready you can add a router that has built-in VPN capabilities and then you safely introduce the Internet to your network AND have remote access to the BI server so you can view your cams from outside your network using your VPN.

 

[J Sigmo]

Welcome, Larry and others.

Getting into security cameras IS opening a huge can of worms, no doubt.

I think most of us start out seeing the camera/NVR kits sold at stores, or the individual cameras sold everywhere, and read their advertising, and come away imagining how easy this all will be.

Then we find shortcomings, or find out how dangerously insecure these systems are if set up as instructed right out of the box.

So then we start reading up, and there is a steep initial learning curve if we want to optimize everything. And that sucks all of the joy of inexpensive instant gratification right out of the whole endeavor.

Then we spend a few months or years learning and slowly building a more ideal system, tweaking and adding things until, as @bigredfish says, we've spent a few thousand bucks, not to mention hundreds of porn-deprived hours as @windguy points out, learning stuff we never imagined we'd be studying.

The next phase is that a neighbor or friend asks us about setting up a security cam setup, and we get the sad task of taking all of the fun out of their dreams, too!

You've just got to power through it all. Welcome to what you thought might be a few hours, or maybe a weekend of effort, but which soon becomes a second job... at least for a while.

 

[windguy]

@J Sigmo - Great post. Very well put. My initial foray started when a friend said he got an Arlo system a few years ago, and I asked "What's an Arlo." There are so many turnkey camera systems available in retail stores like Costco and Bestbuy and on Amazon. My biggest take away was that I didn't want an WiFi based system with cameras that have batteries and were buggy systems that were rushed to market that included bells and whistles to look good, cloud storage of data not to mention subscription fees for monitoring in some cases. In reading reviews, I eliminated nearly all those packaged solutions because of numerous reliability problems and poor support that wasn't US based. I wasn't looking to buy a headache that worked poorly. Thankfully I found this forum that offered alternative solutions giving you control over your design.

 

[windguy]

@Larry Smith - you made two good posts sharing more info about your objectives. You and I are pretty much at the same point in this learning curve and both don't have a strong background in networking, so it's understandable to feel overwhelmed and confused. I too have to look up acronyms (multiple times) and fight to comprehend some posts. What's helped me is that I write an email to myself and post information and links to posts that I read that have pertinent info and also product links. Sort of building my own wiki. I keep forwarding the same email as I add more information. If you look in my welcome thread "Talk me off the ledge" you can see a network diagram I posted and modified with the help of other forumites. I now have a basic layout for a dual NIC setup that I understand and can implement. That's a good place to start. Provide a sketch of what your current network looks like and what you are proposing to do.

My statement about "what parameters you have" are things like your current network and house layout. Where can you add cameras or run Cat 5e/6 cable in conduit or through walls? What restrictions or physical limitations does your house or yard require you to have to deal with. The more you share the more help you will get. The gurus will offer suggestions about camera placement and camera types for your requirements and objectives. No one here is going to give you a hard time about asking dumb questions.

Sorry to hear about your wife's battery getting jacked. That sucks. Didn't think perps still stole things like batteries. Must be a local vagrant. You would need at least some basic tools to remove that and a car nearby to transport. Some batteries are tucked away and really hard to get to. I'm guessing you didn't lock the cars doors, but you are doing that now, right? Especially since the perp knows you now have a brand new battery in that same car. Most of the car thefts in our neighborhood are on cars with unlocked doors. That creates an opportunity to easily grab something.

Re facial recognition, I read here that this feature doesn't work very well, but you'd have to search more on that subject for a definitive answer.

Does your neighborhood use the Nextdoor app? I joined that for ours a few months back and you can read about other local crimes to see what the trends are. Very helpful.

 

[TL1096r]

TonyR-

Thanks for the reply. I think I was leaning toward going the BI route and actually basically everything you outlined as well. I guess what is scaring me is all the info relating to networks and setting all that up correctly to avoid being hacked or isolating the cams from the internet. I did go through the guide that you linked as well. I had actually been learning from a few subs on reddit and someone mentioned this forum and also empiretechandy. I am not super computer savvy so again if I’m honest it’s that part of things that’s giving me the most grief because I’m afraid I’ll jacked up something doing all the BI, can setup, VPN, and other related things. It’s also tough because on a lot of the threads and reply’s there’s a lot of comments and acronyms that I have to google. Thanks for just listing the items and points I need to look at.

It is a lot but you will be happy that you went this route instead of wasting time and money on a NVR or a p2p plug and play system that doesn't have the features and have a lot of vulnerabilities.

This outline really can help you get started - go through this list and see what you need:
Newbie Starter Guide to IP Cam System – VPN setup – Computer Hardware – Blue Iris – Dahua Cameras

At any point you have questions from above link we can help.

Setting up a dual NIC is very easy if you follow this:
Dual NIC setup on your Blue Iris Machine

And all internet related queries on your cam will be done through Blue Iris:

 

[J Sigmo]

Another point about the usefulness of this site and the helpful folks here:

As you delve into all of this, you will likely learn a lot of very useful things about securing your network.

Things like setting up a dual NIC system, and setting up your own VPN server to secure your cameras also carries over to, and helps secure, your whole network. And it allows you to access your home or business network remotely and also surf securely on your portable devices despite being on unsecured public WiFi systems.

So the effort to learn and set these things up gives benefits beyond your camera system.

Kudos to everyone who takes the time to help us all out on here.