Home Invasion Robbery - Riverside Police Dept Report 8/29/2017

mat200

mat200

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Jan 17, 2017
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Home Invasion Robbery P17154593 2
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Riverside Police Department
Published on Aug 29, 2017

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HOME INVASION ROBBERY INVESTIGATION On Saturday, August 26, 2017, at about 2:09 p.m., three suspects committed a home invasion

 
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Is this a new trend in SoCal to wear the reflector vests and mimic workers? I saw another video you posted that was similar. Both forced themselves through people. Pretty scary!
 
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So, wouldn't be ok to shoot people like this if a gun was in you're hand? I would imagine it would be OK as long as the bullet doesn't enter their back. Pretty lame ting to rob like this. Time to start controlling the home invasion criminal population.
 
Bradmph said:
So, wouldn't be ok to shoot people like this if a gun was in you're hand? I would imagine it would be OK as long as the bullet doesn't enter their back. Pretty lame ting to rob like this. Time to start controlling the home invasion criminal population.
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If you value your lifestyle, family, financial standing, your house, etc. Don't shoot at people over stuff, that's why you hopefully have insurance.
Only if you feel your life is threatened. Varies in each jurisdiction. Know your local/state laws backwards and forwards.
 
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Bradmph said:
So, wouldn't be ok to shoot people like this if a gun was in you're hand? I would imagine it would be OK as long as the bullet doesn't enter their back. Pretty lame ting to rob like this. Time to start controlling the home invasion criminal population.
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If im on a jury and someone like this gets shot in the back its an automatic acquittal...jury nullification...happens all the time...when you are put in a position like this, Adrenalin rushes, things happen, its the thugs fault...
 
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Bradmph said:
So, wouldn't be ok to shoot people like this if a gun was in you're hand? I would imagine it would be OK as long as the bullet doesn't enter their back. Pretty lame ting to rob like this. Time to start controlling the home invasion criminal population.
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Even if you don't CCW, an insurance program like USCCA is a good idea. If you have a firearm and may use it in self defense (even at home), consider one of these types of membership/insurance. USCCA also publishes a great magazine that will really open your eyes to the liability involved and some of the stories.

This is a tough situation. There was no guarantee that the bad guys were going to just take belongings and not hurt a victim. So if a victim were in fear for their life, which seems reasonable, deadly force would seem to be justified. But local laws and juries vary and lawyers are expensive even for the innocent. Let's hope we never have to make such a call. I am pretty sure if someone breaks into my home like this, I will not think twice about shooting them. I realize that changes your life from then on. Key word "Life".
 
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Bradmph said:
So, wouldn't be ok to shoot people like this if a gun was in you're hand? I would imagine it would be OK as long as the bullet doesn't enter their back. Pretty lame ting to rob like this. Time to start controlling the home invasion criminal population.
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Depends on the Country / State ...

Also depends on if inside the home or outside ( example at the front door vs on the inside of the door )
 
I teach this stuff and I tend to agree with both @looney2ns and @NoloC

Use of lethal force just to protect "stuff" isnt usually a good idea. Stuff can be replaced. Even a good shoot can be very costly.

That said, if as in this situation they use physical force, inside my home, there isnt any way, or enough time, for me to know for certain if they plan on killing or otherwise hurting me or other family members. In this case, the average person would likely have a legitimate "fear of death or great bodily harm". This is the core universal standard of justifiable use of lethal force. Thus in this case if I had access to a firearm, with what limited info we know, I would not hesitate to use lethal force. (Of course most of us would agree simply not to open the door or not to go to the door un-armed would be better tactics)

In Florida, (not all states) we have the Castle Doctrine law and more importantly, Presumption under that statute. Presumption means the State presumes that the innocent party within their own home, with BG's forcibly entering, had a "fear of death or great bodily harm". Thus that big legal hurdle is already met.

Not all states have the same protections and some still require a "Duty to retreat". Read up on the laws in your state.
 
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Bradmph said:
So, wouldn't be ok to shoot people like this if a gun was in you're hand? I would imagine it would be OK as long as the bullet doesn't enter their back. Pretty lame ting to rob like this. Time to start controlling the home invasion criminal population.
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Interesting thing about BG's getting hit in the back.

We discuss this in one of our classes when talking about the OODA Loop. That time that you subconsciously take to Observe/Orient/Decide/Act in just about everything you do. It's a continuous process.

Heavily condensed version:
In two studies, (Tempe Study and Blair with 24 SWAT Officers) they timed various actions/reactions to determine how long it took to fire, draw, stop, etc. of course none of these numbers are carved in stone, each individual is different, but the studies showed some consistent averages:

Avg time for the cognitive brain to Observe & Orient - .4 -.5 sec
Avg time to draw and fire 1 rd on target from concealment 3-7 yds - 1.5 sec

BLAIR
Avg time for BG with gun at side, facing officer with gun drawn, to initiate and get shot off on Officer - .38 sec
Avg time for Officer with gun drawn to react and pull the trigger once he noticed movement of BG gun - .39 sec

TEMPE
Avg time to fire with finger already on the trigger when they saw a green "go" light - .3-.4 sec
Avg time to STOP pressing the trigger after they had decided to - .5 - .6 sec
Avg time to quickly turn ones shoulders/upper body away - .2 -.3 sec


Think about that ;)
Action beats reaction almost every time.
 
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Another thing to think about before blasting away is the possible civil lawsuit, as OJ found out.
 
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FL's deadly force statute recognizes a home invasion (home robbery with occupants present) as a felony assault. Felony assault is one of several qualifier which permits the use of deadly force (whether the BG is stealing goods, (un)armed, or raping your wife, legally doesn't matter). Further, if the investigating law enforcement agency determines the shooting was justifiable, the homeowner is afforded special protections (both criminal and civil). For example, if you over-penetrate, and the round travels across the street and you kill the neighbor's 7yo kid, you are immune from civil action. At least, that's how the law is supposed to work. Add media, cameras, your average civil-rights instigator and their paid-for bused in crowds, and you end up in a completely different place.
 
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