Camera placement suggestions

[Midway]

I’ve ordered a Dahua NVR5216-16P-4KS2E NVR and a mix of 10 Starlight cameras, 5 turret and 5 bullet, and am in the process of planning installation locations. I can add more if needed but prefer to start with no more than 10.

I originally posted the thread linked below and catcamstar gave me some great suggestions but I thought additional views from ground level would help.

Asking for camera recommendations

I have larger pictures but feel this may already be pushing limits and I can include larger individual images if it helps.

Some locations will be a challenge to get to but I think I can find a way.

Suggestions from the experienced to this new guy would be greatly appreciated.

 

[bigredfish]

Just some thoughts but I would start more or less with the Blue cams @catcamstar suggested, I would definitely use the two Red locations for LPR instead of pointing back at the house, overkill IMHO. With as close as you are to the road, Z5's would probably be enough, but you may want Z12's just to be certain. Maybe a couple of matching birdhouses to house them.. or a fake boulder, or just bury them back in the shrubbery..

Overlapping bullets for the drive, tucked in just above those coach lights

Front door obviously, left side same as doorknob, about 6-7ft (no more) between door frame and porch light

That left front corner and entry is tricky due to the trees tight up against the house and that lower window just left of the garage. Id put a 2nd camera next to the left driveway cam pointing that direction covering the walk and left front yard.

Out back, I see 3-4 cameras. One right of door obviously, another on other side of that sun room mirror image of the door cam, (or maybe dead center of the sun room above the middle window?) and one far right covering the double doors. I'd also be tempted to put at least one camera up high for overwatch of the backyard.

The sides get tricky with all the little corners, so focus on choke points.

These opinions are worth exactly what you paid for them

 

[catcamstar]

Asking for camera recommendations

For LPR: see @bigredfish and the various LPR topics. They contain tons of specifics (eg zoom / lightning etc) on that subject.

For your house: let's reverse your question. Image YOU are the bad boy. Imagine you drive by your house, and you have 10 seconds to site recon. The next night, you pop-up, and try to break and enter. Which way would you pick? Would you go left hand side? Or right hand side? If it's 50-50, you have to cover both sides. If right side has a lower facing basement window without bars, then it needs for sure outside AND inside covering. Also keep in mind the "covering FOVs" aspects.

But do not fall for the "I got cams so I am protected" charm: if you think your life & household is in danger: do install a decent alarm system first. That should run in island mode (with battery) and ample sensors on windows & doors. If that's good, then your cams can work as deterrent or for analytics (eg LPR). They do never replace any alarm system.

Good luck!
CC

 

[Midway]

For LPR: see @bigredfish and the various LPR topics. They contain tons of specifics (eg zoom / lightning etc) on that subject.

For your house: let's reverse your question. Image YOU are the bad boy. Imagine you drive by your house, and you have 10 seconds to site recon. The next night, you pop-up, and try to break and enter. Which way would you pick? Would you go left hand side? Or right hand side? If it's 50-50, you have to cover both sides. If right side has a lower facing basement window without bars, then it needs for sure outside AND inside covering. Also keep in mind the "covering FOVs" aspects.

But do not fall for the "I got cams so I am protected" charm: if you think your life & household is in danger: do install a decent alarm system first. That should run in island mode (with battery) and ample sensors on windows & doors. If that's good, then your cams can work as deterrent or for analytics (eg LPR). They do never replace any alarm system.

Good luck!
CC

Thanks catcamstar,

I do have a Vista-20se Security System that was installed 20 years ago. I had it pre-wired when my house was built and like too many, finally had the system installed after our house was broken into during the day when no one was at home.

It has been inactive for a number of years due to having faults on the basement windows zone. With a dog now and me working from home much of the time, I got lazy. I’ve recently replaced the external siren and strobe and thought I had finally cleared the basement faults but they showed up again today. Back to the drawing board. I’ll replace the magnets as a start and get it sorted out and just bypass that zone until I do.

The motivation to rearm the security system is the same as for the camera’s, recent incidents in the neighborhood that have scared my wife and she has asked me to make sure our home is secure, she is scared to be home alone if I am traveling.

We had a neighbor’s home broken into early in the morning while the homeowners were out of country and a house sitter was in the house at the time. There were three of them, apparently, they cut the power, not sure how, and woke the sitter up and he barricaded himself in the bedroom while he called 911. I’m confused why a battery back up wouldn’t have still set of the alarm so I’m sure I am missing the details.

We live on a relatively secluded, dead end private road that can be good and bad. If I put a camera in the front roadside terrace, I could capture every license plate and we know who should and should not be coming and going. One neighbor with a young, delinquent foster daughter would have her very shady friends park at the downhill, south end of my shoulder parking strip where their car could not be seen by me or the girls foster mom due to the height of the retaining wall.

I also have a trail coming up a steep bank in my back yard that someone could come up from if they had a boat or wanted to hack their way through brush. Our dog is a very good deterrent and alerts us to anyone in our yard or even walking down the street. I also have firearms as a last resort if I am home and need to defend my family.

Most of the neighbors have Ring and a couple of them caught a guy jumping their fences and called 911. The police were able to catch the guy and we later learned a man was found at the park at the north end of our lake, dead with three bullet wounds. The guy must have made it to our street from the park and was found with a gun in his back pack that was registered to the man found dead in his car. The police were thrilled to have the evidence as this was a very bad guy they wanted off the streets.

This was the last straw that motivated my wife to request the addition of cameras. While realizing cameras don’t stop the crime, they can discourage thieves and help us put them away so they won’t victimize our neighborhood again.

Final reason, I enjoy the process and am looking at this as n enjoyable hobby that I hope never needs to be used to prove our castle has been attacked.

Thanks again for the input and I apologize for the novel.

 

[Midway]

Here are the camera models I've purchased. I realize I jumped the gun and should have determined locations and coverage first but will now need to make these work.

1 ea. IP Camera IPC-HFW5231E-Z12E 2MP Starlight WDR IR Bullet Network Camera 5.3mm ~64mm 12x Zoom Lens

1 ea. IP Camera IPC-HFW5231E-Z5E 2MP Starlight WDR IR Bullet Network Camera 7mm ~35mm 5X Zoom

3 ea. Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera

2 ea. IP Camera IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 2MP Starlight WDR IR Eyeball Starlight Network IP Camera

3 ea. Loryta IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Bullet AI Network Camera 2.7mm ~12mm Motorized

NVR5216-16P-4KS2E 16Channel 1U 16PoE 4K&H.265 Pro Network Video Recorder

WD Purple 8TB Surveillance Internal Hard Drive - 7200 RPM

 

[catcamstar]

Thanks again for the input and I apologize for the novel.

Thank you for sharing your story @Midway, and I feel some kind of "sense or urgency", however you are preparing your battle, which is good: do not rush into "pre-canned solutions" (eg cam kits) as they may (or may not) fit your requirements all together. Plan plan plan test plan, like another famous forum member always posts

One final tip on alarm which I learned from my alarm installer guy: people always have "alarm activate/deactivate" codes. But imagine a burglar standing next to you at gunpoint, yelling to disable the alarm for the basement. If you would "dare" to trick the alarm, and sirens go pewpewpew, you're pretty much signing your death wish. So today, there exist "silent alarm" codes. It "behaves" like a normal "deactivation" code, no sirens, no flashlights, no tasers. But it does ring your alarm central (or 911 - in my country alarm systems cannot directly call, that is in an unmanned conversation, the police).

If you have time, and want to "enjoy" the ip cam journey, I would advice you to "mess with the best": order 1 HFW5231-Z5 and 1 HFW5231-Z12 from @EMPIRETECANDY. Both are varifocal (so you can "setup" the lens zoom), both are star lights (so good at night). Buy a 2$ "bucket" from costco, a pole of 3m. And some UTP cable spins. And install these cams on "test positions". Run them during 24h.

And you'll quickly learn which setting/cam is best for your environment.

Good luck!
CC

 

[catcamstar]

Here are the camera models I've purchased. I realize I jumped the gun and should have determined locations and coverage first but will now need to make these work.

1 ea. IP Camera IPC-HFW5231E-Z12E 2MP Starlight WDR IR Bullet Network Camera 5.3mm ~64mm 12x Zoom Lens

1 ea. IP Camera IPC-HFW5231E-Z5E 2MP Starlight WDR IR Bullet Network Camera 7mm ~35mm 5X Zoom

3 ea. Loryta IPC-T5442TM-AS 2.8mm Fixed Lens 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Eyeball AI Network Camera

2 ea. IP Camera IPC-HDW5231R-ZE 2MP Starlight WDR IR Eyeball Starlight Network IP Camera

3 ea. Loryta IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Bullet AI Network Camera 2.7mm ~12mm Motorized

NVR5216-16P-4KS2E 16Channel 1U 16PoE 4K&H.265 Pro Network Video Recorder

WD Purple 8TB Surveillance Internal Hard Drive - 7200 RPM

It is what it is, but you won't regret it, apart from the Loryta I haven't got experience. For all other readers of this topic: if the HDW5231 is in a vandalproof position, there is a (smaller) dome variant yet vandal proof (HDBW).

Have you thought about an IP based intercom system? Interesting gadget which gives you 24/7 capability to view your door stations, but also "pretend to be home" even when being abroad. Your NVR is able to hook up to that feed to and register 24/7.

Cheers!
CC

 

[Midway]

Thank you for sharing your story @Midway, and I feel some kind of "sense or urgency", however you are preparing your battle, which is good: do not rush into "pre-canned solutions" (eg cam kits) as they may (or may not) fit your requirements all together. Plan plan plan test plan, like another famous forum member always posts

One final tip on alarm which I learned from my alarm installer guy: people always have "alarm activate/deactivate" codes. But imagine a burglar standing next to you at gunpoint, yelling to disable the alarm for the basement. If you would "dare" to trick the alarm, and sirens go pewpewpew, you're pretty much signing your death wish. So today, there exist "silent alarm" codes. It "behaves" like a normal "deactivation" code, no sirens, no flashlights, no tasers. But it does ring your alarm central (or 911 - in my country alarm systems cannot directly call, that is in an unmanned conversation, the police).

If you have time, and want to "enjoy" the ip cam journey, I would advice you to "mess with the best": order 1 HFW5231-Z5 and 1 HFW5231-Z12 from @EMPIRETECANDY. Both are varifocal (so you can "setup" the lens zoom), both are star lights (so good at night). Buy a 2$ "bucket" from costco, a pole of 3m. And some UTP cable spins. And install these cams on "test positions". Run them during 24h.

And you'll quickly learn which setting/cam is best for your environment.

Good luck!
CC

Thanks for the advice but that ship has sailed, I am already receiving the equipment listed in my previous reply. I could have been more patient but want a system installed before I go on my next extended trip.

Lucky for me two of the cameras you recommended I've already ordered.

 

[catcamstar]

Thanks for the advice but that ship has sailed, I am already receiving the equipment listed in my previous reply. I could have been more patient but want a system installed before I go on my next extended trip.

Lucky for me two of the cameras you recommended I've already ordered.

It's better to have a ship sailing than Titanic wise sunk. Anyway: do test out positions before you fix them to the walls softfits. You won't be the first filming "hats" and "hoodies" instead of ID material.

 

[Midway]

It is what it is, but you won't regret it, apart from the Loryta I haven't got experience. For all other readers of this topic: if the HDW5231 is in a vandalproof position, there is a (smaller) dome variant yet vandal proof (HDBW).

Have you thought about an IP based intercom system? Interesting gadget which gives you 24/7 capability to view your door stations, but also "pretend to be home" even when being abroad. Your NVR is able to hook up to that feed to and register 24/7.

Cheers!
CC

I have not thought about an IP based intercom system but that sound interesting. What would you recommend?

Thanks

 

[catcamstar]

I have not thought aboeut an IP based intercom system but that sound interesting. What would you recommend?

Thanks

I also got Dahua system (2*VTO2000A plus touch screen VTH1550CH indoor) - it was a pain in the **s to deploy (worth reading through: [Review] VTO2000A & VTH1550CH & VTNS1060A Intercom Kit) however it is now running very stable since that topic ended up in a positive way. Even on 4g and VPN open, I can pick up the doorbell with less than 1 second "delay". Nobody knows I'm (not) home. VTO2000A even has a relay (which I use to "open" my electric fence) - all from the app / VTH touch screen.

If you look at (for example) https://www.webstore4ipcameras.nl/documentation/Dahua_VTO2101E-P_manual.pdf, they explain different VTO/VTH models - only pitfall is that some devices (like my VTO2000A) does not use POE, but requires a "special" VTNS POE switch. Later models do not require that switch anymore. Do not use wifi / wireless / battery doorbells unless strictly forced by WAF

Hope this helps!
CC

 

[Midway]

My hard drive arrives today and I won't have any more excuses not to get to work.

I have a question on the best route for my CAT 6 cable. Seems I have two options, running the cable up and through the attic and down the outside of the house to the camera location or through my crawlspace and up the outside of the house to the camera location. The crawlspace is only on the back half of the house (half basement in front of house, crawl space on back half.)

The two cameras on each side of the garage should be no problem.

If I install a camera next to the front door i will likely half to run down from the attic.

the two cameras on the front SE corner would need to be run along the side of the house from the crawl space and then up to the camera location.

For cameras on the back half of the house, any issue with conduit at easy reach to be cut? I'm thinking I would have video up until the time they cut it, possibly an overlapping image and possible fear from the bad guy of getting electrocuted.

I have a concrete slab poured near the chimney that I hope to build a shed on soon so may need to hold off on installing a camera on that corner or leave enough slack so I can easily re position it.

Thoughts, easier way, anything I am missing or should be considering?

Yes, I will test the camera locations before final installation.

Thanks.

 

[catcamstar]

My hard drive arrives today and I won't have any more excuses not to get to work.

That's a great motivational speech

Unfortunately, my projects all involved "new" housing, in which cabling was foreseen in-wall, for example with preflex cables. But indeed, if you are afraid of being "cut off", I suggest you go top-down. Or try to "lift" some of the wooden planks and place cable underneath?

Otherwise:

 

[mat200]

My hard drive arrives today and I won't have any more excuses not to get to work...

Hi @Midway,

looking good.

btw - I really do like cameras at the entrances at eye level, so you may want to consider that option also ( I've used the mini-dome wedge on my setup ).

I do know routing the cable to that location can be challenging. If you have vinyl siding it maybe easier than you think as there are tools which allow you to open up the siding and then you can slip the cat5e/6 under it.

definitely test the locations with a friend acting as a prowler wearing a cap and hoodie.

 

[Midway]

Coming from a DSLR background, I am surprised by how tiny even the low light starlight camera sensors are.

Also makes it easy to understand the upside of 2 MP; The MP's must get awful tiny the more you pack on those tiny sensors.

 

[bigredfish]

Given your story, I would also highly recommend a firearm and training for you and the Mrs..

 

[Midway]

Given your story, I would also highly recommend a firearm and training for you and the Mrs..

I am well armed, rifles, shotgun, revolver and multiple pistols. Military father who raised me well, took me hunting, trap/skeet shooting and everything else at the range. My wife is now interested in at least knowing how to safely operate a firearm, where and how I secure them, and where extra magazines are. Maybe I can get her to take a safety class, include the kids and make it a family affair. Crazy happenings you would never expect in our neighborhood are reality.

Thanks.

 

[Midway]

Finally started my installation. Took a pandemic to find the time. Any input on the first two installations? They are both IPC-B5442E-ZE 4MP Starlight+ WDR IR Bullet AI Network Camera 2.7mm ~12mm Motorized. They are at 23 zoom.

Aim, zoom, overall coverage? I have 8 more left on the list a few of the house and property at the top of the thread.

posts up. There are also more pictures

Thanks.

 

[Midway]

First 4 mounted, 6 more available. I think I have figured out a convenient and secure place for my NVR and will be able to start running conduit and final cabling.

and secure place