SD59225U-HNI startup motor skipping

Putimir

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Hi all, all of a sudden, one of my SD59225U-HNI stopped responding, and upon power cycling (POE) the dome does not do it's usual initialization ("spin around"...) but it sounds like PTZ motors are "skipping"; I can see a bit of moving (jerking) of the dome. Already tried different port, I assigned the port as critical as far POE power allocation, I tried another switch. The dome was in operation for cca 3 years without a hitch (except maybe the motors became louder with time).

Any ideas guys?

Thanks a lot.

Best regards from Slovenia

Jure
 

handinpalm

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Yes, I have an idea, my SD59225U-HNI did the same thing after I did a Manual Reboot from the cameras GUI. I had my cam in operation ~4 years w/o any problems on a POE+ switch. When I did manual reboot the motor stuttered and could not communicate with it. I tried hard reset from the internal switch, but did not help. I then powered cam up from the included 24VAC Dahua power supply, and it came back to life and full operation. I did resets after that and still would not operate with POE+ switch, only external 24VAC power. I do run cam on non-POE switch port while powering with external supply now. Give it a try and report back. Good luck that was a good cam, now have to run AC power to cam for operation. BTW, anyone with this cam, I would NOT do a manual reset on it, or else.
 

Putimir

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Hi, HAHA, in the meantime I did just that...yes, the camera does power on external 24v...(running parallel with POE) I even (once) managed to keep it running solely on POE (after initialized, when I accidentally disconnected external power supply).

The external power is not feasible for me :(

After some digging around I also noticed this strange output from my cisco sg300: the wild voltage fluctuations on the port (gi8):

switchaf07b1#show power inline consumption

Port Power[W] Power Limit[W] Current[mA] Voltage[V]
---------- ------------- ---------------- ------------ ------------
gi1 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi2 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi3 7.200 31.500 147 49.0
gi4 7.500 31.500 145 52.0
gi5 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi6 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi7 5.500 31.500 87 63.0
gi8 0.200 31.500 4 66.0

switchaf07b1#show power inline consumption

Port Power[W] Power Limit[W] Current[mA] Voltage[V]
---------- ------------- ---------------- ------------ ------------
gi1 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi2 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi3 7.300 31.500 141 52.0
gi4 8.0 31.500 146 55.0
gi5 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi6 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi7 4.500 31.500 104 43.0
gi8 0.200 31.500 4 66.0

switchaf07b1#show power inline consumption

Port Power[W] Power Limit[W] Current[mA] Voltage[V]
---------- ------------- ---------------- ------------ ------------
gi1 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi2 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi3 7.100 31.500 149 47.0
gi4 7.500 31.500 145 52.0
gi5 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi6 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi7 4.600 31.500 90 51.0
gi8 7.300 31.500 141 52.0

switchaf07b1#show power inline consumption

Port Power[W] Power Limit[W] Current[mA] Voltage[V]
---------- ------------- ---------------- ------------ ------------
gi1 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi2 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi3 7.200 31.500 149 48.0
gi4 7.400 31.500 145 51.0
gi5 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi6 0.0 31.500 0 0.0
gi7 4.700 31.500 89 53.0
gi8 7.300 31.500 4 2433.0!!!!!!
 

Putimir

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I think the manual reboot is not the culprit, It's more likely that reboot caused the initialization of the cam, where the problem probably lies (high power demand with full speed movements)
 

tibimakai

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Maybe, the cam's internal poe power supply part got busted? Maybe a shorted smd capacitor? It tries to reboot/power on, and the protection kicks in?!
 

looney2ns

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This sounds like a bad cable issue. Were the outdoor connections properly waterproofed at time of install?
Di-electric grease, and coax seal tape used?
Was Solid Copper cable used, and not copper clad aluminum?
 

Putimir

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Hi looney2ns, thanks; I have to admit, no, sadly, no extra waterproofing was made, but the camera was not directly exposed to water, it was under a roofing; cabling in a aluminium pipe; the pins on the connector are spotless, nevertheless I cleaned them using contact spray and I tested with brand new 1m length cable...

I'm not sure what the cable strands are made of, but it pretty good looking FTP cable...
 

iveco300

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Hello to all. for a couple of days I have the same problem and in my opinion due to the latest firmware update. what do you think?
 

handinpalm

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Hello to all. for a couple of days I have the same problem and in my opinion due to the latest firmware update. what do you think?
I never updated firmware and have the problem. It is like the unit is starved for current when powering up. There is either a problem with the internal POE power circuit not putting out enough current or the POE power negotiation handshake circuit is nonfunctional. I do not have any issues with cabling or RJ45 pins on cam connectors (never exposed to moisture).
 

Putimir

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I have now managed to power it via POE using a cisco aironet AP POE injector...(it seems maybe the poe supply has to be more "dumb"/less negotiation)....not ideal but hey...othervise it wouldnt start on several different switches (interestingly enough, the other class4 devices have no problem running on these switches) .

Does anybody know the latest PTZ firmware for this camera? I'm on:
System Version 2.800.0000000.5.R, Build Date: 2019-08-27
PTZ Version 2.300.0000000.10.RHNT_170926_24381
 

handinpalm

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I have now managed to power it via POE using a cisco aironet AP POE injector...(it seems maybe the poe supply has to be more "dumb"/less negotiation)....not ideal but hey...othervise it wouldnt start on several different switches (interestingly enough, the other class4 devices have no problem running on these switches) .
Well that is encouraging. Have you cycled power on injector multiple times to make sure it is stable? I have tried 3 different Netgear POE+ switches on short cables w/o luck. What mfgr switch did you try?
 

Putimir

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Hi I have tried with 3 different sg300 switches (2 of them brand new, I thought the one that was 3 years in service with constant 50W output gave in), older cisco 3750 and a Mikrotik CRS328 ...So far, the cisco injector is keeping up, had several updates and resets, but no extensive testing...right back into service haha
 

teemu81

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I have seen it hapening enough times on Dahua cameras, usually the problem is in a capacitor in charge of the PoE powering up. Camera won't start up or will keep giving limited connectivity, the link light on the switch would be on for five-ten seconds then it'll go down as if the camera is constantly rebooting.
The cheapest-easiest way to work around the problem is using a PoE injector since the only problem is related with the PoE powering.
Usually Dahua won't apply warranty on those issues stating the problem was overvoltage via the PoE and repairing it would be around 150€/$ as they replace the whole board, not just the faulty capacitor.
 

tibimakai

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This would be a surface mount capacitor? That is what I have suspected. most likely it is shorting the poe rail.
 

Putimir

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I have seen it hapening enough times on Dahua cameras, usually the problem is in a capacitor in charge of the PoE powering up. Camera won't start up or will keep giving limited connectivity, the link light on the switch would be on for five-ten seconds then it'll go down as if the camera is constantly rebooting.
The cheapest-easiest way to work around the problem is using a PoE injector since the only problem is related with the PoE powering.
Usually Dahua won't apply warranty on those issues stating the problem was overvoltage via the PoE and repairing it would be around 150€/$ as they replace the whole board, not just the faulty capacitor.
Oh! Do you have an exact idea, which cap it is? Is it repairable by hand using hobby grade soldering station or hot air station? Disassembly on the SD59225U-HNI is quite easy and fast...

Thanks
 

tibimakai

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If I'm right, it should be getting hot that capacitor. Some alcohol(ipa) should show it.
 

Putimir

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Hello again, sorry to report that even with the cisco injector the camera is no longer booting up....I have now resorted to using "external" power supply, but now I have realized, that the camera has only AC24V input wires...

Can the camera be safely powered using 24V DC supply? I've done a quick test and the camera does power on and function (seemingly) ok on DC input, but my question is: will it last?

Thanks
 

handinpalm

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If the camera has a true 24VAC input, it most likely has a transformer followed by a bridge rectifier, to produce an internal DC voltage. When you apply a DC voltage to the transformer, it will look like a very low resistance to the 24VDC supply and it would probably end up damaging the supply and transformer in the cam. You should feel the power supply get very warm/hot over time. Measure the input voltage w/ a DMM and see if it is loaded down to a lower voltage. Why are you using a DC PS when you have the correct OEM AC supply? From what you told me previously about the injector working on the cam, I bought a POE+ injector to try on my cam. The cam did not power up at all, so I was wondering what you were actually doing. Use the OEM supply like I am doing. If need be, place the OEM PS somewhere where you can house it and run external cabling to the cam.

The OEM PS could also be a full wave rectified pulsed positive output and they are calling it AC. Therefore, you would be safe to use 24VDC. I have not looked at the OEM PS with an oscilloscope to see if it is a true sinewave output.

Edit: I looked at the output of the OEM PS and it an AC sinewave. So, what you are doing with the DC PS, I would put on the "Don't try this at home" list.
 
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Putimir

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If the camera has a true 24VAC input, it most likely has a transformer followed by a bridge rectifier, to produce an internal DC voltage. When you apply a DC voltage to the transformer, it will look like a very low resistance to the 24VDC supply and it would probably end up damaging the supply and transformer in the cam. You should feel the power supply get very warm/hot over time. Measure the input voltage w/ a DMM and see if it is loaded down to a lower voltage. Why are you using a DC PS when you have the correct OEM AC supply? From what you told me previously about the injector working on the cam, I bought a POE+ injector to try on my cam. The cam did not power up at all, so I was wondering what you were actually doing. Use the OEM supply like I am doing. If need be, place the OEM PS somewhere where you can house it and run external cabling to the cam.

The OEM PS could also be a full wave rectified pulsed positive output and they are calling it AC. Therefore, you would be safe to use 24VDC. I have not looked at the OEM PS with an oscilloscope to see if it is a true sinewave output.

Edit: I looked at the output of the OEM PS and it an AC sinewave. So, what you are doing with the DC PS, I would put on the "Don't try this at home" list.
Thank you for the extended explanation, unfortunately I'm not that skilled in electronics to full understand what type of transformer I need :(

As said, I have used the camera for some 2+ years using POE until it did not power on anymore...first I suspected the switch and by trying out a few different combinations it powered on using 3rd party power injector...this combination is also failing now upon boot (it does succesfull pan, but on tilt it powers down), so the last option was the direct power supply...I tried DC (i did noget a power supply with my camera) by accident by failing to realize the input is supposed to be AC not DC, and powering it with dc power supply in it worked...o_O:facepalm:

I don't have 24VAC supply/trasformer at hand, but I'm more then willing to buy it, can you recommend one? We have 220V here in EU....

Sorry for being such a dumbass and thank you very much!

Jure
 

handinpalm

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220V power supplies/transformers are difficult to find in US, because we use 120V. The china P/N of my supply is STD-3024S, but it is 120V input. This PS is rated at 3 Amps, which is an overkill for this cam. Probably get away with 1.5 - 2 Amp transformer. You can buy a 220V to 24V stepdown transformer and put a fuse/breaker on input/output, but if you don't know what you are doing, 220V can be lethal. Maybe Andy has some European versions laying around he would sell?
 
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