HFW-1831E - what really *is* the latest firmware (and do we care...)?

RubberDucky

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Hi,

I've recently received two HFW-1831E from Andy. They have the jan '19 firmware version 2.62 18 R. The firmware update/check in the web browser claims this is the latest firmware.

However I see here ( Firmware) dahua lists 2.62 23 R as the latest firmware.

And I see here (4K starlight Series Firmware Update 20190404) Andy calls out a "huge update" for this camera going from 2.62 to version 2.80.

So, what firmware version are people using? How is it working out? If you are using a later version are there any performance or functionality improvements? and is the firmware stable? I'm not inclined to upgrade without a big reason to do so. The current firmware seems OK so far.
 

msquared

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I own 3 of this model, and I should have followed the rule of if it ain't broke, don't fix it. I update 2 of three cameras to 2.800 firmware from 2.622. The two cameras I update to 2.800 exhibit what I would consider out of control bitrate. The bitrate is all over the place going from 4Mb to 20Mb/s. I didn't change absolutely anything else in my entire system other than update the firmware, default the cameras thru web interface, and changed settings to my static ip and password. The camera I left on 2.622 does not do this. The 2.800 cameras exhibit this no matter whether I tried setting VBR or CBR, any bitrate setting, the camera does not conform to. The only way I can get the 2.800 cameras to a stable bitrate is to run in 4MP resolution, and it will hold 8Mb/s. I did not alter the iframe from default setting, but I do know that if you set the iframe too far apart from the fps the camera will exhibit a high bitrate reading at the iframe, and progressively lower bitrates on subsequent frames, until the next iframe. I post about this topic some time ago to see if anyone else have similar issues with no reply. I post more recently to see if there was any difference between the factory default setting thru the web interface, and using the reset button within the camera. This weekend I was going to have to get the ladder out and take the cameras down to try a factory reset using the internal button. This is just my opinion, unless a firmware fixes some issue you're having, or adds a feature you really want, consider to leave it alone.
 

RubberDucky

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Wow... Hopefully someone else who upgraded to 2.800 will post their results.

Hard to believe they'd release such an obviously flawed version (but I'm new and maybe that's par for the course in this industry), anyway maybe something went wrong with your update. Have you tried doing the factory default multiple times? Even a power cycle might be worth a try. Otherwise the hardware reset is worth trying for sure. If you have the file downloaded, can you do a firmware update again as a last resort (after trying the h/w reset)? I assume your bit rate is the number from the web interface and not some downstream software that may be messing up the bit rate reporting for some reason.
 

msquared

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I've tried everything except the hardware reset. I don't have an explanation, but if I run the camera as intended, all default settings 8MP at 8Mb/s, I see bitrate variations and huge gaps in recordings in my NVR software. I didn't dig into it further because ultimately I'm sure it's something on my end, otherwise there would be more posts. It was just a cautionary tale of that if you don't need to upgrade, don't. I get no error messages in the camera logs, yet I see large periods of time where my NVR software has no recordings from my 2.800 cameras. This doesn't happen with the 2.622 cameras. I use the NVR software that I use because it does what I need it to do and it's stable. Therefore I accept responsibility and consequences for my poor decision when I upgraded the firmware, and now cannot use my 8MP cameras at 8MP. Another note to be aware of, you cannot downgrade once you update to 2.800.
 

RubberDucky

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I was hoping to get more responses. Especially given your issue. Maybe there aren't that many hfw1831's out there. Anyone else using them? If so, what firmware? Thanks.
 

msquared

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FYI, the factory reset using the internal button made no difference.
 

Hazza06

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i have the IPC-HFW1831E running F/W V2.800.0000000.5.R, Build Date: 2020-01-07, and not observed the erratic B/W behavior. And i've experimented quite a bit with VBR and CBR with small i-frame intervals to get the best possible VQ....interestingly enough, the max stated configurable CBR bitrate = 8192 Kbps, however, with small i-frame setting, and at max 25fps 4K resolution, in bright daylight scenes, the reported bit rate is closer to 14 to 15Mbps for CBR, so i'm not complaining at all w.r.t achievable operational video bitrate....the VQ is quite good for the price point.

i have found though one annoying quirk, with motion detection enabled, and when motion is detected in the video, very often there is lost video for a second or 3 at time of motion detection. quite annoying. It seems the either the F/W motion detection a bit buggy, or perhaps F/W / SoC seems to prioritize motion detection over video capture / encoding SoC processing cycles etc

To me VQ is more important, so i've left motion detection disabled for now...i have another IPC field of view watching this camera where motion detection is enabled....
 

msquared

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Interesting. Where did you disable motion detect? I may do this also.

I have Blue Iris doing the motion detect (on the substream), not from the camera input. I have constant record of the main stream to other NVR software. Another interesting thing I figured out recently, ever since moving the 1831's to the 2.8 series firmware, none of them show the bitrate that the camera is set to in the camera interface, at almost any resolution. If I have the iframe set to twice the frame rate, the bitrate runs at 50% higher than set in the camera. If I set the iframe equal to the frame rate, I get 50 to 100% higher bitrate than what the camera is set to. So if I set 8mp resolution, bitrate 8Mb/s, 30 fps, 60 iframe, bitrate runs at 10MB/s, but it is set to 8Mb/s. If I change the iframe to 30, bitrate runs up to 16Mb/s, but the camera is set to 8Mb/s. Most people would not mind this, but 1. these numbers are not consistent, even though I have CBR set, the higher it goes, the more the bitrate goes all over the place, almost acting like VBR is set, and 2. this isn't what the camera is set to, the camera should adhere to the settings. I've confirmed it's not the software I use to constant record the main stream, because I see the same issue of higher than camera setting bitrates in Blue Iris also.

I don't know what to do anymore, I just find a combination of resolution, frame rate, i frame, and bit rate settings that will keep the bitrate consistent. I'm just pissed, mostly at myself, partially at Dahua, because these are excellent cameras (for me).

My only speculation from all this is that the only firmware that has any type of quality testing would be the firware that the camera comes with. Otherwise the manufacturer risks an average user seeing these issues and just returning the camera or moving to another brand. Any other firmware update to the camera by the user, and it basically turns into the Wild West, and any expectation of things working correctly are now null and void.

I have contacted the vendor about this, but (in a very concise summary) it seems that this issue "is what it is". I guess because the issue isn't getting 100's of posts. I haven't even approached the topic of a warranty claim since I updated the firmware from what the camera originally came with, and because I have no guarantee that any replacement camera would come with 2.6 series firmware. I don't even care what changes 2.8 series firmware brings over 2.6 series, because all I know is that one main point of a security system is stability, and I didn't see any issues until moving to the 2.8 series firmware. And it does not matter which of the 2.8 series firmware I use, they all have the same issue. Any post I've made on the issue, usually results in a "if it ain't broke don't fix it" confirmation, so I must be the only person who sees this issue. So at least I've learned that from this issue.

Another interesting tidbit, using H.265, everything works perfectly flawless. I can run full 8MP resolution, 30fps, 30 i frame, 8Mb/s bitrate, and that's what the camera does, that's what is reported in any NVR software.

And before someone elses asks the next question of why don't I just run the cameras in H.265 all the time, it's because the software I currently use to record constantly on the main stream does not support H.265. I am currently investigating other NVR software to match the features I like in the current software, but also supports H.265.
 

Hazza06

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IPC motion detection is disabled via camera GUI, once logged in click on setting > Event > Video Detection, then uncheck Motion Detection Enable button. I also record 24x7x365, and have enough NVR storage for my requirements, so disabling motion detection is a non issue for me...Would be good if Dahua could fix it though, as the motion detection seems to work fairly well otherwise the issue of momentary lost video...

1599952605331.png


i've since also found the motion detection issue seems to be a generic Dahua F/W, as my other Dahua IPC ( later generation IPC-HFW2831*-*-S2 models ) also have the same issue, i also since found another thread that talks about the video split on B or P frames when motion is detected. Dahua need to fix this such that the video is split on the next I frame ( complete image frame )...on motion detection, would resolve the issue....

Interesting you found the h.265 is more like CBR, i changed briefly to h.265 codec and also confirm your findings, but i also found the pulsating noise at every i frame to be quite noticeable, making for the dancing grass scene every i-frame drove me nuts, so i've reverted to h.264 where the pulsating noise at every i frame almost unnoticeable...I also run h.264 mostly for the reason for better playback compatibility, for example should i need to share video with others, have better chance of playback compatibility with h.264, as h.265 being newer codec etc. I actually don't mind the h.264 behaving more like VBR ( when set for CBR ), i also observed the bitrate increases with more ambient light lumen in the scene, which makes sense, with more lumen's the sensor will detect more detail, more detail == higher B/W...

I also run with i-frame interval = frame rate, ie i-frame interval = 25 for 25fps video. I found an article that Dahua base their max bit rate on an assumption that the i-frame setting = 2 * fps setting, which explains why we see almost 2 times the b/w figure when reducing i-frame interval setting to equal the fps setting, but i'm completely ok with that, as the VQ is just stunning for the price point, no complaints from me...now i got the settings in a happy / stable position....Looks like i'll purchase some additional 1831E's for the price, they represent very good value for money IMO...
 
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msquared

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That's strange, mine are the opposite. If I have the settings on 8MP at H.264, at 2x fps I get the i-frame pulse bad. If I match fps and i-frame is even worse. The best I can get is to get the pulse tolerable is 6MP at 6MB/s, the fps doesn't matter. If I run 8MP, I get the pulse using anything from 15-30 fps. The setting that makes the most difference is to lower the resolution. As for the time of day, it's about 9pm where I'm at, so the camera is in B/W, I tested by setting to 8MP, 30fps, 30 i-frame, 8Mb/s, the bitrate is running 11-12Mb/s on a static scene, with the i-frame pulse. Daytime with these settings would be 13-16Mb/s, I've seen it peak at 20Mb/s.

I would have left the camera at the default settings for resolution, fps and the like, but I experience issues with playback of the recordings, so I didn't have much of a choice but to find settings to stabilize the issue as best I could.

I'm too heavily invested in all these cameras to start switching them out, as I haven't found a suitible replacement. I'm also partial to the size (they are a perfect fit under the soffit, very protected), although optical zoom would be nice. I'm thinking about just sucking it up and getting better software that supports H.265. I'm pretty sure what I'm looking at for my 24/7/365 will export with a player in the event anything ever needs to go to LEO.

H.265 runs at exactly whatever I set the camera settings to, at all times, and no pulse.
 
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Hazza06

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i wonder did Dahua change the SoC, my 1813E was manufactured June 2018, here my SoC details as below = DH7200, out of the box it was running 2.62.something, i upgraded to V2.800.0000000.5.R, Build Date: 2020-01-07 very early in installation during pre-staging the camera...but even so i do recall the h.264 image was just as stable on 2.62, i didn't even bother trying h.265 on 2.62...

hharry@ubuntu-s01:~$ curl --digest --globoff ""
appAutoStart=true
deviceType=IPC-HFW1831E
hardwareVersion=1.00
processor=DH7200
updateSerial=IPC-HFW1831E
hharry@ubuntu-s01:~$
 

msquared

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Can you teach me how to do this? I don't have any knowledge on this. My cameras are connected to a POE switch, with just standard 192.168.x.x static IP addresses.
 

pozzello

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just put that url in your browser, filling in your cam's ip, of course, and password when prompted


here's mine, for example:

appAutoStart=true
deviceType=IPC-HFW1831E
hardwareVersion=1.00
processor=DH7200
serialNumber=4H0319BPAG4899B
updateSerial=IPC-HFW1831E
updateSerialCloudUpgrade=IPC-HFW1831E:01:02:02:64:2C:00:01:00:00:00:00:320:00:00:00:00:00:00:00:00:200
 
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msquared

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OK, thanks @Hazza06 and @pozzello I got it, all my 1831's show hardware version 1.00 and processor of DH7200 also. Since I didn't see any issues when at 2.6, I never bothered with H.265 at that time either.
 

msquared

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Some further info just in case it's useful at a later point, at night, the cameras will run within the settings I choose. Today I test setting 8MP @ 8Mb/s, 30fps, 30 i-frame, and actual bitrate ran 14-16 Mb/s, with i-frame pulse. At night, same settings, camera bitrate showing normal at about 8Mb/s, 30 fps, 30 i-frame, and NO i-frame pulse.
 

Hazza06

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the I frame pulse is very difficult to see in night vision mode, as you've only got shades of grey, but it's still there. Luckily the current and latest 2.8 F/W has very little i-frame pulse with h.264, even in the brightest daylight scenes.
 

pozzello

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how does i-frame pulse interfere with identifying the bad guys when somethng goes down? it doesn't. concentrate on the important stuff...
 

Hazza06

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how does i-frame pulse interfere with identifying the bad guys when somethng goes down? it doesn't. concentrate on the important stuff...
the quantization error at every i-frame distorts the image, which reduces the clarity of the image, which is particularity important, especially for tying to identify finer detail in images, such as rego number plates etc...so yes it's vitally important subject, and we'll happily continue discussing...anyways, i've got my i-frame pulsing to a minimum on latest 2.8 F/W and using h.264 > happy days...
 
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