Camera locations for future house

[learningtocode42]

Hello all! After posting in the intro thread, posting here for suggestions on camera placements for a new build, as I have an option to pre-wire.
Neighborhood is in the quiet part of town, so not looking for extreme setup, but definitely would like it to be useful for ID if a need arises.
Pictures attached are of similar houses that I was able to find online, as well as how the house will sit on the lot/street (to the best of my drawing abilities haha)
Cameras 6 and 9 will be doorbell cams, 7 will be inside the arch looking at the door. 8 will be angled down. The rest should be seen on picture with arrows.
Let me know your thoughts/suggestions! (even if this firs try is 100% horrible lol) Blank slate to play with at this point.

P.S. potentially an LPR as well somewhere around cam 5 or 1?

 

[dudemaar]

looks ok, except cams 1-5 I would be lowering to approx. 6-7 ft high for ID purposes.

 

[sebastiantombs]

8 and 11 also need to be much lower, as in 7.5 feet, 8 feet absolute max above finished grade to provide any hope of identification. Also keep in mind that wide views look nice from a 2,8mm lens but if you expect to identify someone, especially someone unknow to you, they'll need to be within five feet of the camera and looking right at it.

 

[saltwater]

I would add cameras covering your sides (1 - 8 and 5 - 11), two each side. Cable is cheap.

 

[learningtocode42]

looks ok, except cams 1-5 I would be lowering to approx. 6-7 ft high for ID purposes.

I was hoping to use soffits for mounting as to not be completely obvious where the cameras are. I assume no point at all in cam 5 then, besides general overview?

8 and 11 also need to be much lower, as in 7.5 feet, 8 feet absolute max above finished grade to provide any hope of identification. Also keep in mind that wide views look nice from a 2,8mm lens if you expect to identify someone, especially someone unknow to you, they'll need to be within five feet of the camera and looking right at it.

Thought behind 8 is to catch whoever is trying to go up the deck. So even they make it all the way up it should take a clear shot, no?

I would add cameras covering your sides (1 - 8 and 5 - 11), two each side. Cable is cheap.

Cable is cheap, cameras are not haha! There are no windows or doors on the sides. While I understand the idea of 360 view, any reasons for side cameras besides seeing which direction someone came from?

 

[mat200]

FYI

 

[SouthernYankee]

Your neighborhood is quite now, wait it will get worse. Nice neighborhood easy pickings. Every one will be a work during the day in a year or so easy pickings.
Set up an alarm system , sensors on all doors, break glass sensors. Loud alarms siren (+120 DB) inside (one on each floor) and outside (front and Back).

As a minimum , indoor cameras pointing at each out side door.
Garage cameras should be at the sconce level no higher than the top of the garage door. pointing down the drive way,
Inside garage camera point at the door.
Camera under the back porch pointing at the lower level back door.
Move camera 10 down to 7 ft up.
I have indoor cameras in all public areas.

Run more wires than you plan on using, it is easier and cheaper to do it now on a two story house.

Do it right the first time and save money then doing it twice.
Cameras are for surveillance, they are not very good as A real time security system.

 

[saltwater]

Cable is cheap, cameras are not haha! There are no windows or doors on the sides. While I understand the idea of 360 view, any reasons for side cameras besides seeing which direction someone came from?

Cable is still cheap. You do not have to connect cameras if you deem it not necessary but at least give yourself the option to connect a camera or two. I have recently gone through the same process and now I'm three months into our new home. I have connected 11 cameras and yet I have 9 spare cable points. I was fortunate enough during the house build to be directly involved in laying the cable.

As others have said, if you can, lower the height of your main cameras. I have 3 spare points under my eaves, double storey house, yes they are up high but I will in time have them as two for overview and one for a weather cam.

 

[mat200]

Hi @learningtocode42

You've got a really nice home coming up.. definitely take some time to plan it out

Also look at other cat6 needs.... access points and the like

Looks like some vinyl siding - so you can run cable under that later if needed...

 

[sebastiantombs]

One other comment, be certain to use solid copper wire and not CCA, copper clad aluminum.

 

[Teken]

As noted by others cable is cheap so the two side zones can be pre-wired for later camera deployment when needed. Trying to do the same in a finished home at that height is nothing but endless pain.

Keep in mind you can compensate for the height (within reason) by installing varifocal lens cameras. This will allow you to zoom into the ideal target area but it still doesn’t address (top of head) views.

Installing a PTZ camera(s) for roaming view would help tremendously given the height and the size of property. Ensure you have your guys pre wire using solid copper CAT6 (23 AWG) cable and not CCA cable that seems to be everywhere like lice!

Copper Clad Aluminum wire is not in wall rated and capable of sustained current. Have them run 18-2 / 22-4 wire with the CAT6 cable so it allows you to run whatever you may need in the future.

That can be a speaker, microphone, PIR, 12 VDC only camera, strobe, siren etc.

Anywhere the Ethernet cable (May) cross 120 VAC wiring. It should not be run parallel with line voltage. If Induced noise is possible Insure those runs use shielded CAT-6E cable.

Grounding: If anything is going to be grounded it must be done to the same (single point) grounding in the home. Failure to follow this basic concept will create a ground loop potential and will damage your electronics.

Lighting: Given a clean slate consider perimeter lighting from above throughout the home and property. It doesn’t matter how great a camera is you simply can’t beat having the ability to turn on lights when and where needed. Whether it be part of the home or motion activated flood lights.

Like cable, lighting is cheap and enhances the homes decor while offering better situational awareness and bolsters any cameras ability to see in the dark.

Speakers: If you haven’t planned for outdoor speakers this is the time. Not only will it allow you to rock the summer. But it will allow you to integrate them into a HA (Home Automation) System to provide more flexibility in PA / alert notification.

LPR: If LPR is in your long term future run the direct burial cable for data & power now. Churning up nice sod and waiting for the grass to recover is painful. Decide how and where you will envision the LPR in a fake rock, bird house, mail box, shrubs?!?

Lastly, make sure all cable is tested for continuity and proper termination and has plenty of service loop. Any zone which is near impossible to run again run a spare!

Coax: In 2021 running coaxial wire in a new install (New Build) is extremely rare. But, having both allows unlimited possibilities in terms of supported hardware that can be used.

None IP (Analog) cameras have less electronics and thus are very cheap to buy and now support HD video. This allows you to manage budget while deploying proven hardware that offers Real Time Video.

Analog cameras offer zero lag in video feed when compared to IP digital cameras.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[samplenhold]

P.S. potentially an LPR as well somewhere around cam 5 or 1?

You have gotten a lot of good feedback so far. I will not bother repeating that.

Since you live on a cul-de-sac, your best bet is to focus on the area where the circle meets the road. Not knowing the distance or what may be in the way after construction, but your position #1 would be the closest with the lowest angle.

 

[learningtocode42]

Phew! A lot of things to absorb and consider, so thank you all for the comments!

Your neighborhood is quite now, wait it will get worse. Nice neighborhood easy pickings. Every one will be a work during the day in a year or so easy pickings.
...
Cameras are for surveillance, they are not very good as A real time security system.

Noted with thanks! Doesn't BI have sort of a real time alert of spotting people, etc?

I was fortunate enough during the house build to be directly involved in laying the cable.
As others have said, if you can, lower the height of your main cameras. I have 3 spare points under my eaves, double storey house, yes they are up high but I will in time have them as two for overview and one for a weather cam.

Lucky to be able to lay cable! I wish I had that opportunity haha! Noted on the rest.
Any reason for weather cam that beats just looking out the window?

You've got a really nice home coming up.. definitely take some time to plan it out
Also look at other cat6 needs.... access points and the like
Looks like some vinyl siding - so you can run cable under that later if needed...

Thank you! Hopefully it gets built right haha.
Already planned for some cabling for mesh system and speakers on deck. Noted on vynil.

As noted by others cable is cheap so the two side zones can be pre-wired for later camera deployment when needed. Trying to do the same in a finished home at that height is nothing but endless pain.
...
Lighting: Given a clean slate consider perimeter lighting from above throughout the home and property. It doesn’t matter how great a camera is you simply can’t beat having the ability to turn on lights when and where needed. Whether it be part of the home or motion activated flood lights.

Noted with thanks! Will give lightning some thought!

Since you live on a cul-de-sac, your best bet is to focus on the area where the circle meets the road. Not knowing the distance or what may be in the way after construction, but your position #1 would be the closest with the lowest angle.

Either #1 or #2, depending which one will give me straight'est shot down the road. Unfortunately in KY front plates not required so only chance is to catch when the vehicle going away.


Additional overall questions based on feedback received:
Lowering cameras:
#1-5 & 11 - at heights that I originally placed them, are they totally useless for ID due to being (relatively) twice as high as a person? If so, does it matter to have any there for general surveillance or just leave one at #5 for that reason?
If they have to be at 7-8 ft, is there any way to mask them to not ruin curb appeal per se? Or just good old paint to match wall/brick color?

Cable wiring:
Noted on all suggestions for multiple drops and which wires to use, will definitely check with the vendor prior to install.
How realistic is it to pull a wire where existing one was? If for whatever reason it needs replacement, etc?
What about running a conduit to the attic and then running the wire from there to all 4 corners of top of the house for whatever needs? (I assume only general surveillance at that height)
Same question for pretty much wires 8-11. With unfinished basement and all wires being originating there, I should be able to just run 8-11 myself yes?

Cameras:
Given my current limited knowledge on cameras that are available, which ones (1-11) would be best to install first and play with, before proceeding with adding the rest? (So kind of order of importance?)

Thanks again for all the thoughtful comments!

 

[samplenhold]

Noted with thanks! Doesn't BI have sort of a real time alert of spotting people, etc?

Yes BI does. But it is not infallible. A good alarm is more important than cams.

Do not go and buy all of the cams at once. Get a good varifocal cam and put it on a test rig as described in the Cliff Notes. Use this one cam to guide you in placement and model selection of other cams. Turrets are harder to spot than bullets. Most people never really notice turrets.

There is nothing wrong with having a few overview cams. I have three. But they will never give you the face shot you need to ID a perp. Unless you have them zoomed in very far away, the angle of attack will be too high to see a face. You will get a great shot of the top of the head.


Here are two threads that show some overview cams and their utility. Also why having more than one cam covering an area is important.

Why I like Continuous Recording (aka 24/7)

So a guy came to the door yesterday, and while my wife did not open the door, it kind of spooked her out. She said he seem suspicious saying he found a driver's license on the lawn and wanted to know if it belonged to her. So when I got back from the range, I checked out the cams. This is one...

ipcamtalk.com

Why I Like Redundant Views/Multiple Cam Views

A lot of newbies ask for help with their camera setups and most think that they can get by with a single cam to cover quite a bit of area. While that is possible if all you are interested in is a wide-angle overview, it usually will not give you a great chance of getting a face shot good enough...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[Teken]

Phew! A lot of things to absorb and consider, so thank you all for the comments!


Noted with thanks! Doesn't BI have sort of a real time alert of spotting people, etc?


Lucky to be able to lay cable! I wish I had that opportunity haha! Noted on the rest.
Any reason for weather cam that beats just looking out the window?


Thank you! Hopefully it gets built right haha.
Already planned for some cabling for mesh system and speakers on deck. Noted on vynil.


Noted with thanks! Will give lightning some thought!


Either #1 or #2, depending which one will give me straight'est shot down the road. Unfortunately in KY front plates not required so only chance is to catch when the vehicle going away.


Additional overall questions based on feedback received:
Lowering cameras:
#1-5 & 11 - at heights that I originally placed them, are they totally useless for ID due to being (relatively) twice as high as a person? If so, does it matter to have any there for general surveillance or just leave one at #5 for that reason?
If they have to be at 7-8 ft, is there any way to mask them to not ruin curb appeal per se? Or just good old paint to match wall/brick color?

Cable wiring:
Noted on all suggestions for multiple drops and which wires to use, will definitely check with the vendor prior to install.
How realistic is it to pull a wire where existing one was? If for whatever reason it needs replacement, etc?
What about running a conduit to the attic and then running the wire from there to all 4 corners of top of the house for whatever needs? (I assume only general surveillance at that height)
Same question for pretty much wires 8-11. With unfinished basement and all wires being originating there, I should be able to just run 8-11 myself yes?

Cameras:
Given my current limited knowledge on cameras that are available, which ones (1-11) would be best to install first and play with, before proceeding with adding the rest? (So kind of order of importance?)

Thanks again for all the thoughtful comments!

Absolutely run multiple (large) conduit with a pull string to a home run location. Have the electrician provide multiple (dedicated) 20 amp breakers and outlets for network / security system / CCTV.

Budget some finances for a pure sine wave UPS. Even though Ethernet cable is all the rage for multi use consider running dedicated HDMI cable to all areas to view the video feed.

Spending hundreds of dollars per unit and wasting electricity on Ethernet to HDMI converters makes little sense in a new build! Going this route insures one less failure point in terms of boxes.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[mat200]

..
If they have to be at 7-8 ft, is there any way to mask them to not ruin curb appeal per se? Or just good old paint to match wall/brick color?
..

HI @learningtocode42

You can paint the cameras to better blend into the house...

Example here:

Brick Wall install and Paint - painting IP security camera to blend in

I thought I would share my latest install on a brick wall, with painting to match. Not too much out there on painting save a few videos on youtube, and a few threads here, so thought maybe this can help some guys. I get all my gear from @EMPIRETECANDY Andy what a nice dude. Now, the intention...

ipcamtalk.com

 

[pozzello]

+1 on a cam (or two) to cover the cul-du-sac. One LPR cam to get every car/plate coming in from and out to the road. Distance from house to road (see samplenhold's image above) will determine cam & lens for that. Another wide-angle high-mounted hi-rez cam to get an overview' of everything going on in the circle...

 

[The Automation Guy]

Are you having to pay someone to do the prewire or is this something they builder will allow you to do yourself.

I totally agree with the idea that you want to prewire to ANY potential location. This means wiring for a full blown, cross coverage system. Odds are you will never install that many cameras, but it's always better to have the wire and not need it than the opposite. I realize that everything has a budget however and if you are having to pay for each drop, you might hit a limit that you can afford. Still, you definitely need to be planning for the future in your drops, not simply what you expect to use initially.

This goes for more than just CCTVs too. Are you wiring for an alarm system (whether you think you will install one or not), network cables around the house (they are really helpful to distribute data - not just from computers), wireless access points in strategic locations, phone/intercom system, AV and video distribution, etc, etc, etc? If not, you need to be.

Wired solutions to all of these things is always better than wireless. Don't simply say, we'll use wireless and call it a day. This is a one time shot during construction to get these items wired in.

 

[learningtocode42]

Do not go and buy all of the cams at once. Get a good varifocal cam and put it on a test rig as described in the Cliff Notes. Use this one cam to guide you in placement and model selection of other cams. Turrets are harder to spot than bullets. Most people never really notice turrets.

I was going to potentially go with the vendor's cameras (from what I have been told 1080p varifocal Speco cams) but given uncertainty on what I need, will probably pass and do testing first.

Absolutely run multiple (large) conduit with a pull string to a home run location. Have the electrician provide multiple (dedicated) 20 amp breakers and outlets for network / security system / CCTV.

Don't have access to electrician, unfortunately. Only after the house is done can hire someone for any work, so perhaps only then they'd be able to install additional breakers.

+1 on a cam (or two) to cover the cul-du-sac. One LPR cam to get every car/plate coming in from and out to the road. Distance from house to road (see samplenhold's image above) will determine cam & lens for that. Another wide-angle high-mounted hi-rez cam to get an overview' of everything going on in the circle...

Seems like wide angle high rez would be perfect for #5 and LPR on #1 or #2. Potentially soffit next to top of the arch, depending on how it looks.

Are you having to pay someone to do the prewire or is this something they builder will allow you to do yourself.
This goes for more than just CCTVs too. Are you wiring for an alarm system (whether you think you will install one or not), network cables around the house (they are really helpful to distribute data - not just from computers), wireless access points in strategic locations, phone/intercom system, AV and video distribution, etc, etc, etc? If not, you need to be.

I have to use a 3rd party vendor to do the pre-wire, otherwise I'd have a field day with all the wiring. Given so many people who have no clue how to hit a nail, I'm not surprised the builder is not taking any chances.
I think at this point I will have them pre-wire the front of the house only, in places where I don't want to go through drywall again, so cameras 1-5 and potentially 7 (not sure how to run cable to outside like that)
Running a few wires for network to have wired backhaul for mesh and for tv. I do need to run some wires for speakers on the deck, but will do it from basement most likely.

 

[mat200]

..

I have to use a 3rd party vendor to do the pre-wire, otherwise I'd have a field day with all the wiring. Given so many people who have no clue how to hit a nail, I'm not surprised the builder is not taking any chances.
I think at this point I will have them pre-wire the front of the house only, in places where I don't want to go through drywall again, so cameras 1-5 and potentially 7 (not sure how to run cable to outside like that)
Running a few wires for network to have wired backhaul for mesh and for tv. I do need to run some wires for speakers on the deck, but will do it from basement most likely.

Hi @learningtocode42

Did you get a nice data center / closet setup on the floor plan?